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  1. #1
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    Default Can God...?

    Raise the dead? Any exceptions if your answer is yes? Why not if your answer is no?

    I'm going somewhere with this question but I'm curious first as to who commits to what answer...
    They're not terrorists. They're just people bitterly clinging to their guns and Qurans.

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  3. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by optrader View Post
    Unsurprisingly you missed my point. The idea of evolution is that all species had a common origin. Primordial ooze gets zapped or aliens seed the earth- whatever theory floats your boat because despite all this "irrefutable evidence" you claim exists, you got zilch in explaining how something lifeless became life. Evolution starts AFTER that somehow happens. Point is, all life evolved from a single cell and somewhen along the way BANG, ya got DNA! Evolution says that because our DNA is so similar to a chimpanzee, we must be related in the distant past. This is like saying the pickup truck evolved from the connestoga wagon because both have 4 wheels and can carry cargo. If God CAN create life in 6 days, and if DNA is the building block of all life, why does God have to use millions or billions if years for it to evolve into different things? If it's a suitable building block, why not just modify it to design the different creatures in the spot as needed?
    You need to ask God why he decided tho let natured take its course over billions of years.
    .

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  5. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by optrader View Post
    You guys claim the science us irrefutable, yet it isn't really is it? You can't have it both ways, either it is or it isn't.
    people of low intelligence try to refute it all the time. There are even people who try to refute that the earth is round. Are you one of those as well?
    .

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  7. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Koushi Shinigami View Post
    You need to ask God why he decided tho let natured take its course over billions of years.

    Well, here's the thing, The only word we have from God is in written form, unless He's giving you personal visitations. Why don't you ask Him why He attached his name to a book full of lies...
    They're not terrorists. They're just people bitterly clinging to their guns and Qurans.

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  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Koushi Shinigami View Post
    people of low intelligence try to refute it all the time. There are even people who try to refute that the earth is round. Are you one of those as well?
    No, actually science refutes science. You can deny the csnyon system created by Mt. Saint Helen's in a matter of years, you can deny a flight of British airplanes buried by 270 feet if ice in less than 70 years, but there's things happened nevertheless. You CAN truthfully say I'm not a scientist, nor do I claim to be, but many scientists with respected credentials, can refutes old earth theories with new earth theories far better than I using the same scientific methods. BTW, yes, I do refute the earth is round, it's actually an oblate spheroid. Im surprised someone of your high intelligence wasn't aware of this. Public school did you a disservice.
    They're not terrorists. They're just people bitterly clinging to their guns and Qurans.

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    Quote Originally Posted by optrader View Post
    Well, here's the thing, The only word we have from God is in written form, unless He's giving you personal visitations. Why don't you ask Him why He attached his name to a book full of lies...
    He didn't. The only one I know of who attached his name to that book was king jimmy.
    .

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  13. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by optrader View Post
    No, actually science refutes science. You can deny the csnyon system created by Mt. Saint Helen's in a matter of years,

    Don't have to. You're comparing the erosion of loose volcanic ash in a few years to the carving away of bedrock over millennia or even eons. intellectually dishonest of you, but I expect nothing more of you.

    Quote Originally Posted by optrader View Post
    (snip)
    You CAN truthfully say I'm not a scientist,
    (snip)
    No ****ing ****. Now there's a news flash. Perhaps you should refrain from professing in ignorance.
    .

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  15. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by optrader View Post
    Unsurprisingly you missed my point. The idea of evolution is that all species had a common origin. Primordial ooze gets zapped or aliens seed the earth- whatever theory floats your boat because despite all this "irrefutable evidence" you claim exists, you got zilch in explaining how something lifeless became life. Evolution starts AFTER that somehow happens. Point is, all life evolved from a single cell and somewhen along the way BANG, ya got DNA! Evolution says that because our DNA is so similar to a chimpanzee, we must be related in the distant past. This is like saying the pickup truck evolved from the connestoga wagon because both have 4 wheels and can carry cargo. If God CAN create life in 6 days, and if DNA is the building block of all life, why does God have to use millions or billions if years for it to evolve into different things? If it's a suitable building block, why not just modify it to design the different creatures in the spot as needed?
    Oh well now you're moving the goal posts. If all you know about abiogenesis is "lightning zap" or "aliens" then seriously...open a book. Maybe visit talkorigins.org. #1 I never said anything is inherently irrefutable - but scientific theories make 1000 times more sense than a magic God doing voodoo creation. Please tell me optrader, what EXACTLY about current theories of abiogenesis do you think are invalid? Have you ever actually read about abiogenesis outside of pop culture creationism? Hint: the concept of molecular evolution, to self replicating polymers, to RNA/single celled organisms isn't at all what you describe. And, please quit with this "why would God do this instead of that". In 2018, we look at what IS. Not what some 2000 year old ancient mythology asserts.

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  17. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by optrader View Post
    Unsurprisingly you missed my point. The idea of evolution is that all species had a common origin. Primordial ooze gets zapped or aliens seed the earth- whatever theory floats your boat because despite all this "irrefutable evidence" you claim exists, you got zilch in explaining how something lifeless became life. Evolution starts AFTER that somehow happens. Point is, all life evolved from a single cell and somewhen along the way BANG, ya got DNA! Evolution says that because our DNA is so similar to a chimpanzee, we must be related in the distant past. This is like saying the pickup truck evolved from the connestoga wagon because both have 4 wheels and can carry cargo. If God CAN create life in 6 days, and if DNA is the building block of all life, why does God have to use millions or billions if years for it to evolve into different things? If it's a suitable building block, why not just modify it to design the different creatures in the spot as needed?
    Zilch? Here: http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/abioprob/ plenty of references to get you started

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  19. #39

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    Optrader, do you believe in the speed of light?

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  21. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by optrader View Post
    Well, here's the thing, The only word we have from God is in written form, unless He's giving you personal visitations. Why don't you ask Him why He attached his name to a book full of lies...
    The people who wrote it claimed God wrote it. If scientists could just make stuff up and assert God says so, then man, life would be so much easier for them

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  23. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by optrader View Post
    You guys claim the science us irrefutable, yet it isn't really is it? You can't have it both ways, either it is or it isn't.
    I never said science is irrefutable. New evidence is always possible. I said currwnt scientific theories are our best frameworks. You're the one storming in here with your claims that the Bible is irrefutable because the Bible says God wrote it. Not very convincing.

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  25. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by optrader View Post
    Unsurprisingly you missed my point. The idea of evolution is that all species had a common origin. Primordial ooze gets zapped or aliens seed the earth- whatever theory floats your boat because despite all this "irrefutable evidence" you claim exists, you got zilch in explaining how something lifeless became life. Evolution starts AFTER that somehow happens. Point is, all life evolved from a single cell and somewhen along the way BANG, ya got DNA! Evolution says that because our DNA is so similar to a chimpanzee, we must be related in the distant past. This is like saying the pickup truck evolved from the connestoga wagon because both have 4 wheels and can carry cargo. If God CAN create life in 6 days, and if DNA is the building block of all life, why does God have to use millions or billions if years for it to evolve into different things? If it's a suitable building block, why not just modify it to design the different creatures in the spot as needed?
    Holy crap dude. It's not just the DNA. It's the fossil record, in conjunction with geological drifts...do you know how incredibly diverse the phylogenetic tree of hominids and the branching to apes is? I mean damn dude, you're comparing this to a pickup truck? Is the intellectual rigor you live your life with?

    https://en.m.wikibooks.org/wiki/Intr...rly_Chronology

    Also, you realize that we share almost 98% of our DNA and we also share something like 30% of our DNA with rice? Huh. That's strange. It's almost as if we all evolved from a common ancestor because we share a lot of DNA.

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  27. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by ImRightYoureWrong View Post
    Optrader, do you believe in the speed of light?
    Not as a constant.
    .

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  29. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Koushi Shinigami View Post
    He didn't. The only one I know of who attached his name to that book was king jimmy.
    I know it's futile to try and get answers out of you, but what the heck, I'll try again.

    How do you know what you know about God? Let me put this question in this framework: I never met Abraham Lincoln. I've never met anyone who met or knew Abraham Lincoln. I've never seen interviews on TV or you tube of people who met or knew Abraham Lincoln. Know why? Because Lincoln, and everyone who did know or meet him is dead! All I, or you know of Lincoln comes from WRITTEN, and thanks to a relatively new technology, photographic record of his life, which is READ and studied by people who orally have passed it to you, or have themselves written newer books based on other WRITTEN things about him which you, in turn have read.

    I'm going out on a limb here and asserting that God has not granted you an interview, directly whispered in your ear or sent an eyewitness of his existence and life in Heaven to give you first hand knowledge of and proof of his existence. Anything intellectualy dishonest about this?

    So what would you know of God if there wasn't a written record of God, Jesus and his life that people could read and study and pass to you orally or by writing books of their own? How would you even know to search for the truth and existence of the one true God if such a record didn't exist?

    I'd be glad to reason further if you care to, I started this thread to reason with believers. With your anti Baptist bias and IRYW's anti Christian bias, reasoning seems an uphill battle.
    They're not terrorists. They're just people bitterly clinging to their guns and Qurans.

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  31. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by optrader View Post
    I know it's futile to try and get answers out of you, but what the heck, I'll try again.

    How do you know what you know about God? Let me put this question in this framework: I never met Abraham Lincoln. I've never met anyone who met or knew Abraham Lincoln. I've never seen interviews on TV or you tube of people who met or knew Abraham Lincoln. Know why? Because Lincoln, and everyone who did know or meet him is dead! All I, or you know of Lincoln comes from WRITTEN, and thanks to a relatively new technology, photographic record of his life, which is READ and studied by people who orally have passed it to you, or have themselves written newer books based on other WRITTEN things about him which you, in turn have read.

    I'm going out on a limb here and asserting that God has not granted you an interview, directly whispered in your ear or sent an eyewitness of his existence and life in Heaven to give you first hand knowledge of and proof of his existence. Anything intellectualy dishonest about this?

    So what would you know of God if there wasn't a written record of God, Jesus and his life that people could read and study and pass to you orally or by writing books of their own? How would you even know to search for the truth and existence of the one true God if such a record didn't exist?

    I'd be glad to reason further if you care to, I started this thread to reason with believers. With your anti Baptist bias and IRYW's anti Christian bias, reasoning seems an uphill battle.
    When you start to display some basic reasoning skills, then we can talk.
    .

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