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    Quote Originally Posted by Cratic3947 View Post
    Article on how Trumps EO may doom Obama care by allowing choice. He allows small business to get together and buy across state lines, and to provide short term plan that don't have all the requirement of Obama care like mental health and BC pills etc..

    "Trumpís executive order directs his administration to begin formulating an approach to allow small businesses to join together across state lines to purchase coverage through what are known as Association Health Plans (AHPs). The executive order also expands access to short term coverage plans that donít comply with Obamacare requirements"

    http://dailycaller.com/2017/10/12/tr...oom-obamacare/
    http://www.nydailynews.com/news/poli...icle-1.3558499

    You tell me...
    that his biggest promise was to repeal and replace Obamacare on day one....
    He forgets to sign it????
    He can hardly give 2 ****s......in his mind it's a loss.....
    And everyone knows it...

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  3. #196
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sknyluv View Post
    As is the case with most of Trump's decisions, he's willing to make things worse without having a viable replacement in mind. See Iran deal, Paris agreement, Dreamers, Climate polices, etc.

    Your unsubstantiated and absurd opinion is noted. If you don't like it, take it to court.


    JWK

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  5. #197
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    Quote Originally Posted by zantax View Post
    That's odd, I had lower rates, lower deductibles, and better care before Obamacare.
    Can you name any year that your rate went down? Not sure what you expect here. Since we know that healthcare costs were rising before Obamacare it is most appropriate to compare the rate at which your costs were rising before Obamacare versus the rate they rose after Obamacare. And it is best not to rely on anecdote but on data when considering policy, wouldn't you agree?

    Luckily, someone has already performed the analysis for us:

    http://time.com/money/4503325/obama-...sts-obamacare/
    The Kaiser study shows that average family premiums rose 20% from 2011 to 2016. That rate of increase is actually much lower than the previous five years (up 31% from 2006 to 2011) and the five years before that (up 63% from 2001 to 2006).


    The Kaiser study shows that average family premiums rose 20% from 2011 to 2016. That rate of increase is actually much lower than the previous five years (up 31% from 2006 to 2011) and the five years before that (up 63% from 2001 to 2006).
    The point is, you can never be too greedy.

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  7. #198
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    For those who are curious as to who is affected by this:

    2017 FPL Guidelines: 48 Border States and D.C.

    (For households with more than 8 persons, add $4,180 for each additional person.)
    Persons in Household 2017 Federal Poverty Level Medicaid Eligibility (138% of FPL) Premium Subsidy Threshold (400% of FPL)
    1 $12,060 $16,643 $48,240
    2 $16,240 $22,411 $64,960
    3 $20,420 $28,180 $81,680
    4 $24,600 $33,948 $98,400
    5 $28,780 $39,716 $115,120
    6 $32,960 $45,485 $131,840
    7 $37,140 $51,253 $148,560
    8 $41,320 $57,022 $165,280
    https://www.zanebenefits.com/blog/20...vel-guidelines

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  9. #199
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    Quote Originally Posted by tnt View Post
    What if, like every other industrized nation in the world, we could do both? We could provide you with lifesaving medicine and treatment in a way that did not bankrupt the nation? Wouldn't that be the best solution?
    I'll pass thanks, you are of course free to move to one of them. I like American medicine just fine, it's resulted in spectacular advances for all of mankind.
    Self appointed forum Mark Zuckerberg, feel free to ask me if any news story is real or fake.

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  11. #200
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    Quote Originally Posted by Unaffiliated View Post
    So you're OK with making life harder for Americans as bait to get Congress to act? What kind of leadership is that?
    Call it what you want. If one expects leadership from any politician, they are in for a let down.

    How do you like your Obamacare now? I am definitely OK with it completely failing. Perhaps then the next time a politician trys to screw with healthcare, the American Citizens will stand up and demand they leave it alone like they did with Hillary Care back in the 90s.

    People should be responsible for their own health care.

    The price should be the price no matter who pays for it.

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  13. #201
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam View Post
    So essentially what Trump is saying is this:

    "Oh you're single and you make $17,000 a year? **** you no subsidy/Medicaid for you."
    "Oh you're married and you and your wife make $23,000 a year? **** you no subsidy/Medicaid for you."
    "Oh you're married with three kids and you make $40,000 a year? **** you no subsidy/Medicaid for you."
    "Oh you're married and you have five kids and you make $52,000 a year? **** you no subsidy/Medicaid for you."

    Are we all fine with this? I'm not.
    Lol what?
    Self appointed forum Mark Zuckerberg, feel free to ask me if any news story is real or fake.

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  15. #202
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam View Post
    For those who are curious as to who is affected by this:

    2017 FPL Guidelines: 48 Border States and D.C.

    (For households with more than 8 persons, add $4,180 for each additional person.)
    Persons in Household 2017 Federal Poverty Level Medicaid Eligibility (138% of FPL) Premium Subsidy Threshold (400% of FPL)
    1 $12,060 $16,643 $48,240
    2 $16,240 $22,411 $64,960
    3 $20,420 $28,180 $81,680
    4 $24,600 $33,948 $98,400
    5 $28,780 $39,716 $115,120
    6 $32,960 $45,485 $131,840
    7 $37,140 $51,253 $148,560
    8 $41,320 $57,022 $165,280
    https://www.zanebenefits.com/blog/20...vel-guidelines
    So essentially what Trump is saying is this:

    "Oh you're single and you make $17,000 a year? **** you no subsidy/Medicaid for you."
    "Oh you're married and you and your wife make $23,000 a year? **** you no subsidy/Medicaid for you."
    "Oh you're married with three kids and you make $40,000 a year? **** you no subsidy/Medicaid for you."
    "Oh you're married and you have five kids and you make $52,000 a year? **** you no subsidy/Medicaid for you."

    Are we all fine with this? I'm not.

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  17. #203
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam View Post
    Those examples are people who were receiving subsidies for health care and now will not.
    Derived from where? Did you compare those figures to last year? Your own link says

    Individuals whose household income falls between 100 and 400 percent of the FPL may be eligible for a premium tax subsidy that can lower their health insurance cost.
    Self appointed forum Mark Zuckerberg, feel free to ask me if any news story is real or fake.

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  19. #204
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    Quote Originally Posted by zantax View Post
    Lol what?
    Those examples are people who were receiving subsidies for health care and now will not.

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  21. #205
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnwk View Post
    Your unsubstantiated and absurd opinion is noted. If you don't like it, take it to court.
    Speaking of absurd opinions.

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  23. #206
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    Quote Originally Posted by Unaffiliated View Post
    No, it was a dodge. I believe some people think making Obamacare hurt Americans will hasten improvements or straight repeal. I also believe the folks that think that way would rather avoid explaining or justifying that position.

    I want to see Obamacare gone as much as the next guy but I'm not willing to make life harder for Americans in the interim to do it and I'm not willing to make them pawns to force Congress to act. You can call that a lot of things - leadership of all the people isn't one of them.
    I have zero qualms about hurting people living off my money they have no right to.
    Self appointed forum Mark Zuckerberg, feel free to ask me if any news story is real or fake.

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  25. #207
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    Quote Originally Posted by zantax View Post
    False, I don't claim to know where he was born, but think he most likely was born in Hawaii, I just don't blindly accept jpg's on the internet as actual evidence of it.
    And you pretend that was the only evidence. LOL
    The point is, you can never be too greedy.

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  27. #208
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnwk View Post
    His answer was appropriate whether you like it or not.

    JWK




    American citizens are sick and tired of being made into tax-slaves to finance a maternity ward for the poverty stricken populations of other countries who invade Americaís borders to give birth.

    No, it was a dodge. I believe some people think making Obamacare hurt Americans will hasten improvements or straight repeal. I also believe the folks that think that way would rather avoid explaining or justifying that position.

    I want to see Obamacare gone as much as the next guy but I'm not willing to make life harder for Americans in the interim to do it and I'm not willing to make them pawns to force Congress to act. You can call that a lot of things - leadership of all the people isn't one of them.
    All together now!

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  29. #209
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    Quote Originally Posted by Borgia View Post
    And you pretend that was the only evidence. LOL
    I don't take his parties operatives word for it either.
    Self appointed forum Mark Zuckerberg, feel free to ask me if any news story is real or fake.

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  31. #210
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    Quote Originally Posted by komobu View Post
    I'm not only fine with it, I'm great with it. Set up a charity and give them your money if you want. I have no objection to that.

    People should stop depending on the govt for their subsistence and depend on themselves. They will be much happier.
    This, if you want charity from me, ask nicely and I'll think about, if you want to coerce it from me, take a a hike.
    Self appointed forum Mark Zuckerberg, feel free to ask me if any news story is real or fake.

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