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Thread: NEA Funding

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    Default NEA Funding

    Received this on my Facebook page.

    Immediately after the election Trump transition spokesman Jason Miller explained that Melania would be staying in New York because there was obviously a sensitivity to pulling out a 10-year-old in the middle of the school year.

    We have since learned that the cost of security for Melania and Barron to remain at Trump Tower is $183 million/year. There is also no indication that they will actually move to DC this summer. So in essence the Federal government is giving the Trump family a $183 million annual voucher so Barron can attend the elite private prep school of his choice.

    Meanwhile, we learned last night that Trump's budget would completely eliminate funding for the National Endowment for the Arts. The NEA, with an annual budget of only $148 million, is able to provide seed money for arts programming in literally every Congressional district in the country.

    So, on the one hand you have a $183 million school voucher for a single 10-year-old at an elite private school. On the other hand you have a program that impacts arts and cultural programming throughout the entire nation.

    Thoughts?
    One day I will say I use to have MS.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Samm View Post
    Only if it is accomplished too quickly. The economy would easily adjust to a slow steady reduction of debt and if the reduction was paced properly, at no point would it become "too little."

    Not even too quickly.

    Remember what happened last time Treasuries were abandoned by banks seeking safe and liquid AAA private market packaged investments?

    I can agree with you on reduction of the debt... how we do that is another conversation.

    When Andrew Jackson paid off the debt, it led to a crash, partly because banks went crazy.

    Zero debt is not only a pipe dream, it is oddly enough fiscally unsound.
    Kakistocracy n. (kak·is·toc·ra·cy / kękɪsˈtɑkɹəsi) Government by the worst persons; a form of government in which the worst persons are in power.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jezcoe View Post
    Not even too quickly.

    Remember what happened last time Treasuries were abandoned by banks seeking safe and liquid AAA private market packaged investments?

    I can agree with you on reduction of the debt... how we do that is another conversation.

    When Andrew Jackson paid off the debt, it led to a crash, partly because banks went crazy.

    Zero debt is not only a pipe dream, it is oddly enough fiscally unsound.

    We are talking about Snow's proposal, not economic experiments of the past. The economy is very capable of adjusting to government finagling if it does so slowly enough. Perhaps the 5 year goal to a balance budget and another 5 years to debt reduction is too fast, but do we really want to quibble over that when that number could easily be changed to 6 or 7 or whatever if that is what it would take to prevent economic turmoil? The real point is that at the rate we are going, it won't take long before we are paying more in interest on the debt than we do on Medicaid with Medicare close ahead. Inevitably, the increasing debt is unsustainable.

    "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep." - Saul Bellow

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    Quote Originally Posted by Conan View Post
    Yeah...and have you won any awards?

    Or have your work published?
    Uhhh he has actually.
    its a fox! a bomber fox.... most sneaky of all foxes.... flies overhead without a care in the world then BOOM... fox skitters away

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    Quote Originally Posted by Samm View Post
    We are talking about Snow's proposal, not economic experiments of the past. The economy is very capable of adjusting to government finagling if it does so slowly enough. Perhaps the 5 year goal to a balance budget and another 5 years to debt reduction is too fast, but do we really want to quibble over that when that number could easily be changed to 6 or 7 or whatever if that is what it would take to prevent economic turmoil? The real point is that at the rate we are going, it won't take long before we are paying more in interest on the debt than we do on Medicaid with Medicare close ahead. Inevitably, the increasing debt is unsustainable.

    Medicaid, Medicare and Social Security store their surpluses in Treasury Bills.

    No debt... no Treasury bills means that those social insurance programs would have to find another way to store cash.... because you just can't have a huge room full of money sitting around doing nothing... so that means they would be stored in financial vehicles which are not the backing of the sovereign currency.

    I am not saying that it isn't possible... it is just a lot more volatile.
    Kakistocracy n. (kak·is·toc·ra·cy / kękɪsˈtɑkɹəsi) Government by the worst persons; a form of government in which the worst persons are in power.

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    Quote Originally Posted by reflechissez View Post
    Your opinion is not the truth. Just admit you can't answer the question. Must be tourettes.
    As a parent and brother of two family members with Tourette's, I'll much appreciate not using it pejoratively, thank you very much, It's plenty difficult enough as it is.

    Sorry, pet peeve of mine.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jezcoe View Post
    Here is a white paper written back in 2000 called "Life After Debt" that explored what would happen if the then surplus continued.
    Ideally what would happen once the debt is paid off. Creation of a "rainy day fund" like Utah has. 11% of the rolling average of the education fund, and 9% of the rolling average of the remaining budget (about $500 million dollars). After that congress could cut the tax rate on citizens/businesses or increase spending or a combination of both.

    One of the chief concerns was losing Treasury bills as the benchmark for a lot of what happens in the financial industry. The paper mentions that private indexes could be used as a benchmark. Fannie & Freddy, and even LIBOR is mentioned.
    Let the free market come up with a system for the benchmark for the financial industry.

    It all seems very quaint.

    http://media.npr.org/assets/img/2011...eAfterDebt.pdf

    While there is such a thing as too much debt. There is also a point where too little debt can have just as a negative impact.
    I might be convinced to leave a small amount of debt permissible. and by small amount I am thinking 100 billion dollars . . . or maybe setting a percentage of rolling average of federal revenue.
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    Quote Originally Posted by snow96 View Post
    Ideally what would happen once the debt is paid off. Creation of a "rainy day fund" like Utah has. 11% of the rolling average of the education fund, and 9% of the rolling average of the remaining budget (about $500 million dollars). After that congress could cut the tax rate on citizens/businesses or increase spending or a combination of both.
    Utah isn't a currency sovereign, so it has to operate under those conditions. The Federal Government does not.



    Quote Originally Posted by snow96 View Post
    Let the free market come up with a system for the benchmark for the financial industry.
    That is a horrible idea. Remember 2008? Remember the scandal where LIBOR was messed with so some could squeeze more money from the system?

    Quote Originally Posted by snow96 View Post
    I might be convinced to leave a small amount of debt permissible. and by small amount I am thinking 100 billion dollars . . . or maybe setting a percentage of rolling average of federal revenue.
    I think you would need at least a trillion, which honestly is managable, at the very least to have the liquidity in Treasuries to keep the system running.

    Remember... this is a worldwide system since we are the World Reserve Currency.

    Granted... if that status ever changes, we would be seriously screwed. But we don't have to have the best currency, just the least worst.
    Kakistocracy n. (kak·is·toc·ra·cy / kękɪsˈtɑkɹəsi) Government by the worst persons; a form of government in which the worst persons are in power.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jezcoe View Post
    Medicaid, Medicare and Social Security store their surpluses in Treasury Bills.

    No debt... no Treasury bills means that those social insurance programs would have to find another way to store cash.... because you just can't have a huge room full of money sitting around doing nothing... so that means they would be stored in financial vehicles which are not the backing of the sovereign currency.

    I am not saying that it isn't possible... it is just a lot more volatile.
    "Worthless pieces of paper."
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    Quote Originally Posted by boysmom4 View Post
    Received this on my Facebook page.

    Immediately after the election Trump transition spokesman Jason Miller explained that Melania would be staying in New York because there was obviously a sensitivity to pulling out a 10-year-old in the middle of the school year.

    We have since learned that the cost of security for Melania and Barron to remain at Trump Tower is $183 million/year. There is also no indication that they will actually move to DC this summer. So in essence the Federal government is giving the Trump family a $183 million annual voucher so Barron can attend the elite private prep school of his choice.

    Meanwhile, we learned last night that Trump's budget would completely eliminate funding for the National Endowment for the Arts. The NEA, with an annual budget of only $148 million, is able to provide seed money for arts programming in literally every Congressional district in the country.

    So, on the one hand you have a $183 million school voucher for a single 10-year-old at an elite private school. On the other hand you have a program that impacts arts and cultural programming throughout the entire nation.

    Thoughts?
    I think both are a waste of money. The federal government has no business funding the arts. Let the free market decide who and what art is bought.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jezcoe View Post
    Utah isn't a currency sovereign, so it has to operate under those conditions. The Federal Government does not.
    Doesn't have to, but it COULD. very limited debt set BY amendment so that it can't be messed with. And a reserve fund. (utah's budget is 16 billion and a 500 million rainy day fund). Fed could do that with a 3 trillion dollar debt have a 500 billion rainy day fund. Utah a couple years ago raised the percentages in the funds after the 2008 crash. They found out they needed a little more cushion for a collapse like that.

    That is a horrible idea. Remember 2008? Remember the scandal where LIBOR was messed with so some could squeeze more money from the system?
    I guess you want to completely regulate the checks on income, and if the person applying can afford the payment they agree to as well? There is bad stuff that happens. Have the rate set by treasury didn't stop the 2008 crash. Set stiff penalties for anyone that messes with however the benchmark is set. Make it a mandatory non parole sentence, and not at a country club prison either. (as in if it's companies, have their ceo's presidents and board ALL charged. Possibly even seizing the company and selling it or appointing new owners. Put pressure on the board to keep things right -- stocks in the company are voided. Any number of ways to keep them in line knowing if they cross it . . . it's essentially a death penalty offense.)

    I think you would need at least a trillion, which honestly is managable, at the very least to have the liquidity in Treasuries to keep the system running.
    How about this. Set it to a trillion (with a 3 trillion budget however that's about a 33% of spending *IF* that much comes in), then lower it over 10 years to 13% or so.

    Remember... this is a worldwide system since we are the World Reserve Currency.
    And that effects our budget how? Majority of the national debt is held by the government and those in the United States. 65% ownership of US debt is domestic 35% foreign.

    Granted... if that status ever changes, we would be seriously screwed. But we don't have to have the best currency, just the least worst.
    Maybe balanced budgets and less debt than we have now would make it a stronger and better currency.
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    Quote Originally Posted by snow96 View Post
    Doesn't have to, but it COULD. very limited debt set BY amendment so that it can't be messed with. And a reserve fund. (utah's budget is 16 billion and a 500 million rainy day fund). Fed could do that with a 3 trillion dollar debt have a 500 billion rainy day fund. Utah a couple years ago raised the percentages in the funds after the 2008 crash. They found out they needed a little more cushion for a collapse like that.
    So we are cool with the US having debt now?

    Quote Originally Posted by snow96 View Post
    I guess you want to completely regulate the checks on income, and if the person applying can afford the payment they agree to as well?
    How did you get that out of saying that Treasury notes used as a super stable and liquid benchmark is a positive thing.

    There has never been a private financial vehicle in history that can match it.

    Quote Originally Posted by snow96 View Post
    There is bad stuff that happens. Have the rate set by treasury didn't stop the 2008 crash. Set stiff penalties for anyone that messes with however the benchmark is set. Make it a mandatory non parole sentence, and not at a country club prison either. (as in if it's companies, have their ceo's presidents and board ALL charged. Possibly even seizing the company and selling it or appointing new owners. Put pressure on the board to keep things right -- stocks in the company are voided. Any number of ways to keep them in line knowing if they cross it . . . it's essentially a death penalty offense.)
    We sadly have a very bad track record of putting bankers in jail.

    I don't see that changing any time soon.


    Quote Originally Posted by snow96 View Post
    How about this. Set it to a trillion (with a 3 trillion budget however that's about a 33% of spending *IF* that much comes in), then lower it over 10 years to 13% or so.



    And that effects our budget how? Majority of the national debt is held by the government and those in the United States. 65% ownership of US debt is domestic 35% foreign.



    Maybe balanced budgets and less debt than we have now would make it a stronger and better currency.
    The majority of the debt is from three things. Medicare, Social Security, and the Military.

    Medicare and Social Security are funded through their own payroll tax. Now that has to carry a certain amount of treasuries in case of an economic downturn and the revenue stream goes down, one cannot reduce those payments.

    If I were king, I would remove the income cap on the payroll tax and impose a form of means testing for benefits. I would also give a slight raise to those payroll taxes.

    To offset those taxes I would raise the capital gains tax to pay for a reduction in taxes imposed on labor.

    Do whatever one can to make sure that those two social insurance programs are self funded... and yes I know that holding them in treasuries makes it so the money can be spent twice into other parts of the government... but we are a currency sovereign and we owe the debt to ourselves and not some foreign entity.

    This is where I would face electoral death.

    I would first impose a comprehensive and exahaustive audit of the Pentagon. Since they have the ability to lose track of a few Trillion dollars, I don't see why we should give them more money. But find out where the money goes. Then, I would add a payroll tax to pay for Military expenses. Get it all above board. Make the people see how much it costs.

    If we want to go to war, taxes go up. Make the cost of the military transparent and not this fuzzy amorphous blob.

    All the other stuff, the discretionary budget, is such small beans, it isn't worth dealing with until the largest three expenditures come under control.

    Just my two cents.
    Kakistocracy n. (kak·is·toc·ra·cy / kękɪsˈtɑkɹəsi) Government by the worst persons; a form of government in which the worst persons are in power.

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    Quote Originally Posted by WreckedParty View Post
    I got pissed off when they started running propaganda about gamers, everything that was on that segment was complete garbage from the most pretentious nitwit ever. Other than that, PBS has been agood channel overall.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gaetano "Tommy" Lucchese View Post
    "Worthless pieces of paper."
    Considering that it is absurd to insist that the same entity can both own an asset and owe its corresponding debt ... but since the beginning these "surpluses" have been dealt with that way, having long since been factually spent by congress, it's the abuse inherent in the system.

    FDR came up with what basically amounts to the Chewbacca Defense long before the South Park team were born, distracting silly monkey fall back and all.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jezcoe View Post
    Medicaid, Medicare and Social Security store their surpluses in Treasury Bills.

    No debt... no Treasury bills means that those social insurance programs would have to find another way to store cash.... because you just can't have a huge room full of money sitting around doing nothing... so that means they would be stored in financial vehicles which are not the backing of the sovereign currency.

    I am not saying that it isn't possible... it is just a lot more volatile.
    Using T bills to store surplus is like using a credit card to defer depleting your checking account balance. As long as you have the funds on hand and the bill is paid off in full when due it is not really debt.
    Last edited by Samm; March 21st, 2017 at 3:07 am. Reason: reword

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    Quote Originally Posted by jezcoe View Post
    So we are cool with the US having debt now?
    Like I said I might be convinced to have very LIMITED debt.

    How did you get that out of saying that Treasury notes used as a super stable and liquid benchmark is a positive thing.

    There has never been a private financial vehicle in history that can match it.
    Having is based on government debt it wrong in that it encourages government debt.

    We sadly have a very bad track record of putting bankers in jail.

    I don't see that changing any time soon.
    If the incentive is there to do so then it would.

    The majority of the debt is from three things. Medicare, Social Security, and the Military.
    and ALL should be paid for within the incoming revenue stream (With the two exemptions and how to have them I explained).

    Medicare and Social Security are funded through their own payroll tax. Now that has to carry a certain amount of treasuries in case of an economic downturn and the revenue stream goes down, one cannot reduce those payments.
    That would be the "rainy day fund" until congress could adjust the budget. And in my proposal there is a way to raise taxes. But it has to be a highly popular action.

    If I were king, I would remove the income cap on the payroll tax and impose a form of means testing for benefits. I would also give a slight raise to those payroll taxes.
    There SHOULD be means testing. And insurance companies should be able to sell policies to those that can afford them at any age. Not kick them off and sent them to government care.

    To offset those taxes I would raise the capital gains tax to pay for a reduction in taxes imposed on labor.
    Under my proposal capital gains would be taxed at the single rate and included in a persons income.

    Do whatever one can to make sure that those two social insurance programs are self funded... and yes I know that holding them in treasuries makes it so the money can be spent twice into other parts of the government... but we are a currency sovereign and we owe the debt to ourselves and not some foreign entity.
    again, rainy day fund. Invested in the safest way possible. That might have to be the debt I'd be willing to entertain.

    This is where I would face electoral death.

    I would first impose a comprehensive and exahaustive audit of the Pentagon. Since they have the ability to lose track of a few Trillion dollars, I don't see why we should give them more money. But find out where the money goes. Then, I would add a payroll tax to pay for Military expenses. Get it all above board. Make the people see how much it costs.
    I have previously said I would like BRACC type commisisons to go through every agency and every department to find waste, mismanagement, and corruption and present reductions/savings/reforms that congress gets and up or down vote on with no changes.

    If we want to go to war, taxes go up. Make the cost of the military transparent and not this fuzzy amorphous blob.
    That's one of my two exemptions. But I set the threshold really high to declare war. Can only last two years, then the declaration has to be re-authorized.

    All the other stuff, the discretionary budget, is such small beans, it isn't worth dealing with until the largest three expenditures come under control.

    Just my two cents.
    Some of the little small beans stuff needs to be dealt with now. As we've seen even the small cuts send some people into panic the sky is falling mode.
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