Just to be clear. My Top 5 Reasons for Legalizing Drugs

[Tigerdrafted]

Not gonna do a damn thing for the violence in Mexico, and that's not why we'd be doing it anyway. Not a good enough reason. Getting stoned, however, is a perfect reason.

Mexico has decriminalized small amounts. Of everything. People are still dying in large numbers at the hands of the cartels. That's never gonna stop. Pot makes up about 5% of their total income.

Quick show of hands, who here thinks the cartels will lay down the Kalashnikovs, sell the haciendas, and swap in the Gulfstream III for John Deere, and then "go back to the land" and farm a crop that commands the same price as corn. Anyone?

Didn't think so. That's too much like work and that's not why they're in this racket. They're going to kill every competitor they can lay their grubby little hands on.

If drugs are legalized, the crime will go away in so far as anything related to supplying drugs to the USA. This is pure objective reason. What you are describing is a bit discombobulated.

First you lose the argument when you state that getting stoned is a perfect reason. Nobody is advocating getting stoned.

In order for drug related crime to cease in Mexico, they would have to legalize all sales of drugs. Not just small amounts. There goes the validity of your observation which you should have questioned. The rest of your post was just creative writing. Bravo.

[TCUFan]

You'd have to live on a border state to understand. It's not hyperbole.

Decriminalization of the possession of every class of narcotic imaginable is not stopping the bloodshed in Mexico. Full stop. I know it's giving you a nightmare, but deal with it.

The border has been the Wild West for a century or two. That's never gonna change just because someone wishes it so.

And by advocating the legal sale of narcotics of all classes, you are supporting getting stoned. What else would you do with it? Unstop a toilet?

[DavidC]

Alcohol and presc pills do not belong in the same conversation as power drugs

Of course they do.

[Ron Mexico]

And by advocating the legal sale of narcotics of all classes, you are supporting getting stoned. What else would you do with it? Unstop a toilet?

Funny, I thought I was supporting individual freedom and liberty to not have government dictate what we put in our bodies.

Of course, everyone is aware is how much of a bang-up job the war on drugs has done in stopping people from getting high, right ?

Interesting fact: more teenagers smoke pot in the US than in the shining beacon of decriminalization Holland.

http://www.eastbayexpress.com/Legali...robert-maccoun

[ThinkingMan]

Of course they do.

Oh sure, to help you with the "we can buy vodka, so we should be able to shoot up" argument..

[Tigerdrafted]

You'd have to live on a border state to understand. It's not hyperbole.

Decriminalization of the possession of every class of narcotic imaginable is not stopping the bloodshed in Mexico. Full stop. I know it's giving you a nightmare, but deal with it.

The border has been the Wild West for a century or two. That's never gonna change just because someone wishes it so.

And by advocating the legal sale of narcotics of all classes, you are supporting getting stoned. What else would you do with it? Unstop a toilet?

I don't support getting stoned. Just to be clear. Did you read my OP? I just realize that there is nothing that I can do about someone else getting stoned and the same applies to the government who has failed consistently in preventing drug use.

It works like this.

First: The government steps up drug enforcement. This has the effect of limiting the supply of drugs. Dealers step on the mix thereby making it less concentrated and more expensive per unit.
Second: Addicts will buy nearly the same amount even at the higher cost per dose that they are addicted to.
Third: The higher cost at the restricted supply increases the profit margin by the dealers.
Fourth: The higher profit margins attracts more people to the drug trade.
Fifth: With more people entering the drug trade, the supply overcomes the previously increased drug enforcement capabilities and soon the supply increases back to normal levels.

This cycle repeats itself over and over as the industry continues to maintain it's force. The only difference is the ever increasing cost of enforcing the drug policies.

[ThinkingMan]

If drugs are legalized, the crime will go away in so far as anything related to supplying drugs to the USA. This is pure objective reason. What you are describing is a bit discombobulated.

First you lose the argument when you state that getting stoned is a perfect reason. Nobody is advocating getting stoned.

In order for drug related crime to cease in Mexico, they would have to legalize all sales of drugs. Not just small amounts. There goes the validity of your observation which you should have questioned. The rest of your post was just creative writing. Bravo.

You are STILL oversimplifying this concept of legalization.

When are you going to venture a guess as to who is going to up and manufacture all the heroin and cocaine so Mexican drug cartels disappear?

Ridiculous.

[TCUFan]

Good for them.

I just want people to be honest. It's not about crime. Or tax revenues. Or even this liberty nonsense. It's about getting stoned. Just say it. "I want to legalize drugs so I can use as much of them as I can." You'll feel better.

I keep saying this and no one's listening. I'm okay with legalizing drugs. All of them. We've been circumventing the Darwinian process for too long. Let the stupid and the weak die off. After a few generations of complete hedonistic excess (you know it's gonna happen, people are going to go nuts for at least a decade) people will figure out drugs are just as bad for you as mom and dad said they were, the killjoys.

At that point, things will go back to normal and we'll have a smarter, cleaner population because of it. Heroin, crack and meth won't be a problem because the users will, well, be dead. We won't have problems with pot users generating more users because of erectile dysfunction after years of smoking ganje.

And I'm not even really worried about a pot user killing me or my family out on the highway. Know why? He's thinking he's moving at Warp Factor 5, Mr. Sulu. His actual speed? 5 miles per hour. I could have a limp and still get out of the way in time.

[TCUFan]

I don't support getting stoned. Just to be clear. Did you read my OP? I just realize that there is nothing that I can do about someone else getting stoned and the same applies to the government who has failed consistently in preventing drug use.

It works like this.

First: The government steps up drug enforcement. This has the effect of limiting the supply of drugs. Dealers step on the mix thereby making it less concentrated and more expensive per unit.
Second: Addicts will buy nearly the same amount even at the higher cost per dose that they are addicted to.
Third: The higher cost at the restricted supply increases the profit margin by the dealers.
Fourth: The higher profit margins attracts more people to the drug trade.
Fifth: With more people entering the drug trade, the supply overcomes the previously increased drug enforcement capabilities and soon the supply increases back to normal levels.

This cycle repeats itself over and over as the industry continues to maintain it's force. The only difference is the ever increasing cost of enforcing the drug policies.

It won't work like that at all.

You're still spending money on enforcement. You're going to have to completely abolish all the rules, no enforcement. Just treating the after-effects.

People will find the dealers making the good stuff. The word will get out.

If you truly want liberty, the government's going to have to completely step back and let people just die.

[Ron Mexico]

Good for them.

I just want people to be honest. It's not about crime. Or tax revenues. Or even this liberty nonsense. It's about getting stoned. Just say it. "I want to legalize drugs so I can use as much of them as I can." You'll feel better.

I find it interesting that you ignored my post where I presented a statistic where cannabis usage happens to be less in a country where it's legal than here.

Do you really think that prohibition is stopping anyone from getting stoned right now ? Did people stop getting drunk in the twenties ?

[TCUFan]

There's also fewer people in the Netherlands.

I teach in public schools. The minute you make it legal, these kids are going to go insane.

On the upside, Taco Bell and the Frito-Lay Company will be be solid investment opportunities.

[Ron Mexico]

There's also fewer people in the Netherlands.

I teach in public schools. The minute you make it legal, these kids are going to go insane.

On the upside, Taco Bell and the Frito-Lay Company will be be solid investment opportunities.

Yeah, the statistics are calculated based on percentage. It'd be silly to compare raw numbers.

Here is another source for cannabis usage by country

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/li...e-cannabis-use

US is #3

[DavidC]

Oh sure, to help you with the "we can buy vodka, so we should be able to shoot up" argument..

If you think Vodka is less destructive then heroin, speed and crack, then you are unaware. They are all hideously terrible to many people. The solution is not to create black markets and gangsters.

[Gaetano "Tommy" Lucchese]

Oh sure, to help you with the "we can buy vodka, so we should be able to shoot up" argument..

Uh, Vicodin and Oxycontin-among many other legal drugs-are opiate derivatives just like heroin.

And alcohol is the most socially destructive drug there is. I figure as a bartender I probably directly enabled at least a dozen deaths and thousands if not tens of thousands of car accidents, fistfights, crimes, wives getting the **** beat out of them and all sorts of wonderful stuff.

[jwil59]

The main objection that I see to legal marijuana is that people want the nanny state to control their own kids for them

There are more holes in small gov conservatism than on a practice green and this is one of them