Drunk Mows Down Woman After Wedding................

[FidelisAdMortem]

...........this time an offduty police officer is the perp behind the wheel drunk.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/ny_crime/2009/09/27/2009-09-27_offduty_cop_andrew_kelly_arrested_in_drunk_driv ing_.html

Way to throw your career and life out the window. A cab ride, 30 bucks, and you'd be home right now waking up with a hangover like normal people.

Tragic.

[JenyEliza]

Throw him under the jail. I have ZERO tolerance for drunk drivers. ZERO.

Cops or not.

We'll see how hard this creep's hand gets smacked, I'm betting not hard. *shrug*

[jeepers]

:(

[FidelisAdMortem]

History of drunk accidents involving civilian/offduty police officers resulting in serious injury or death have resulted in lengthy prison sentences when the appropriate charges are applied. If you were to bet as you say, you'd lose.

However, if you are a sports athlete history shows you receive a few days and a fine.

[jeepers]

History of drunk accidents involving civilian/offduty police officers resulting in serious injury or death have resulted in lengthy prison sentences when the appropriate charges are applied. If you were to bet as you say, you'd lose.

However, if you are a sports athlete history shows you receive a few days and a fine.

And if you're in business in Hollywood, you get rehab.

[JenyEliza]

I'll take my chances on my bet. If this had happened in Atlanta, this cop would be home resting on his couch with an ice pack on his head. His big worry would be a simple Internal Investigation to complete--while being suspended on full pay.

[FidelisAdMortem]

That is your choice, google search results disagree with your stance.

[sgtmac_46]

Throw him under the jail. I have ZERO tolerance for drunk drivers. ZERO.

Cops or not.

We'll see how hard this creep's hand gets smacked, I'm betting not hard. *shrug*

You're betting wrong!

The mistaken perception is that a police officer who commits a crime is somehow 'patted'......the REALITY is that a police officer who gets charged with a crime WILL be prosecuted MORE aggressively than the average person so that the Prosecutor can show the public how tough he is.


Which is no defense of this clown........he DESERVES to be treated like any other person in the same situation.

[sgtmac_46]

History of drunk accidents involving civilian/offduty police officers resulting in serious injury or death have resulted in lengthy prison sentences when the appropriate charges are applied. If you were to bet as you say, you'd lose.

However, if you are a sports athlete history shows you receive a few days and a fine.

True, that........the difference is that being a cop is like being a hated celebrity.......except with ZERO money to pay an attorney. All of the negatives of being 'famous' with ZERO of the perks.

[FidelisAdMortem]

This story just got worse. Looks like there was a second officer in the car as well when this occured.

http://www.1010wins.com/Kelly--2-Cops-in-Car-in-Fatal-DWI/5308585

[JediMindTrick]

I'll take my chances on my bet. If this had happened in Atlanta, this cop would be home resting on his couch with an ice pack on his head. His big worry would be a simple Internal Investigation to complete--while being suspended on full pay.

:rolleyes:

[JediMindTrick]

History of drunk accidents involving civilian/offduty police officers resulting in serious injury or death have resulted in lengthy prison sentences when the appropriate charges are applied. If you were to bet as you say, you'd lose.


Yep, he'll get a lengthy prison sentence unless his BAC comes back under the limit. I didn't see anything in the article that says if they obtained one or not. If he is under the limit then he'll still get time if he's found at fault in the accident.

[JenyEliza]

This story just got worse. Looks like there was a second officer in the car as well when this occured.

http://www.1010wins.com/Kelly--2-Cops-in-Car-in-Fatal-DWI/5308585

Dumbass cops abound. Why does this not surprise me?

Throw the book at BOTH drunk cops. They took a life....now they gotta pay.

[JenyEliza]

Later this morning, a second police officer came forward to say he was also in the car. Police now want to find out if there were other officers in the car at the time of the crash. The investigation continues.

Looks like my scepticsm is warranted. Yet another case of PD CYA.

Nice stuff, boys. Nice. :rolleyes:

[JediMindTrick]

Dumbass cops abound. Why does this not surprise me?

Throw the book at BOTH drunk cops. They took a life....now they gotta pay.

What exactly are you going to charge the other cop with? He was a passenger. Certainly there are some departmental regulations he broke and I'm sure this will cost him his job but I'm very curious to see what law you think he broke.

[JediMindTrick]

Looks like my scepticsm is warranted. Yet another case of PD CYA.

Nice stuff, boys. Nice. :rolleyes:

Just when I think your posts in this thread can't get more absurd. How is it CYA if your coming forward to admit what happened? If it was CYA he'd be denying he was in the car and he would have developed an alibi for where he was at.

[JenyEliza]

What exactly are you going to charge the other cop with? He was a passenger. Certainly there are some departmental regulations he broke and I'm sure this will cost him his job but I'm very curious to see what law you think he broke.

Perhaps it's because he didn't bother to speak up until THIS MORNING...TODAY...about his part in the "accident" that took this woman's life?

Perhaps because they are still searching for *other* cops who may have been involved, but haven't the cojones to step forward?

Hmmmm.....I think my healthy dose of distrust is well placed.


Later this morning, a second police officer came forward to say he was also in the car. Police now want to find out if there were other officers in the car at the time of the crash. The investigation continues.

[JediMindTrick]

Perhaps it's because he didn't bother to speak up until THIS MORNING...TODAY...about his part in the "accident" that took this woman's life?

Perhaps because they are still searching for *other* cops who may have been involved, but haven't the cojones to step forward?

Hmmmm.....I think my healthy dose of distrust is well placed.

You completely avoided my question. Shocking that you did that. Shocking. Now once again, please explain how you are going to charge a passenger in a drunk driving death?

[JenyEliza]

Just when I think your posts in this thread can't get more absurd. How is it CYA if your coming forward to admit what happened? If it was CYA he'd be denying he was in the car and he would have developed an alibi for where he was at.

WHY did he wait to tell what he knew? Why did he wait until later today, instead of last night when the woman was killed? How do we even know he's telling the truth about other cops participating (or lack thereof)?

These cops have impugned their own integrity which makes anything they say suspect (at best). I don't trust someone who can get drunk, kill a woman, go home, go to sleep and then wake up and go to the precinct to tell what he knows.

I don't know why you would---except for your fraternal associations.

Throw the book at the lot of 'em. Lock 'em up. Lose the key.


Later this morning, a second police officer came forward to say he was also in the car. Police now want to find out if there were other officers in the car at the time of the crash. The investigation continues.

[JediMindTrick]

And by the way Jeny, if this was CYA by the cops then please explain how he got arrested at the scene? Sounds to me like the cops on duty did exactly what they should do - enforce the law no matter who is involved. There are at any time 1,000,000 cops nationwide and human nature dictates that some of them are going to be bad and do bad things. Its up to the rest of the cops to ensure they hold the bad cops accountable for those actions and in this case the NYPD did that. Kudo's to the NYPD.:clap:

[JenyEliza]

You completely avoided my question. Shocking that you did that. Shocking. Now once again, please explain how you are going to charge a passenger in a drunk driving death?

Oh, leaving the scene of a fatal accident.

Failure to render aid.

Open container violations.

Probably a drug violation in there too.

Whatever they can find on the ass, they oughta throw at him.

How's that pal? You wanted an answer....there's several and they haven't a thing to do with rules related to the *******'s job.

[JenyEliza]

And by the way Jeny, if this was CYA by the cops then please explain how he got arrested at the scene? Sounds to me like the cops on duty did exactly what they should do - enforce the law no matter who is involved. There are at any time 1,000,000 cops nationwide and human nature dictates that some of them are going to be bad and do bad things. Its up to the rest of the cops to ensure they hold the bad cops accountable for those actions and in this case the NYPD did that. Kudo's to the NYPD.:clap:

Kudos to the NYPD?

The DRIVING COP was arrested.

His buddy old pal (the one who came in today for an interview) walked home, slept it off and then sauntered in when the woman's body was stone cold.

Yeah, sure. :)) :)) :))

BRAVO NYPD. :rolleyes:

Did you not read this from the 2nd article posted by FAM? I've only quoted it 5 or 6 times already.


Later this morning, a second police officer came forward to say he was also in the car. Police now want to find out if there were other officers in the car at the time of the crash. The investigation continues.

[JediMindTrick]

WHY did he wait to tell what he knew? Why did he wait until later today, instead of last night when the woman was killed? How do we even know he's telling the truth about other cops participating (or lack thereof)?

These cops have impugned their own integrity which makes anything they say suspect (at best). I don't trust someone who can get drunk, kill a woman, go home, go to sleep and then wake up and go to the precinct to tell what he knows.

I don't know why you would---except for your fraternal associations.

Throw the book at the lot of 'em. Lock 'em up. Lose the key.

My problem with you and your assertions is that you repeatedly prove time and time again that you are willing to profile all cops based on the bad actions of a few. In this situation one cop made a horrible mistake and at least one other cop made a lesser mistake but they are being held accountable by the other cops. There is no cover up except perhaps by those involved. Its sad that your police hate is so rampant that you can't see that.

[JediMindTrick]

Kudos to the NYPD?

The DRIVING COP was arrested.

His buddy old pal (the one who came in today for an interview) walked home, slept it off and then sauntered in when the woman's body was stone cold.

Yeah, sure. :)) :)) :))

BRAVO NYPD. :rolleyes:

Did you not read this from the 2nd article posted by FAM? I've only quoted it 5 or 6 times already.

Please point out to me anywhere in the article that it says the on duty cops did anything wrong. Please point out where it shows they even knew this other officer was in the car. Oh wait, I know you think they should have used their crystal ball to look back in time to the accident so they would know who was in the car. If the other cop left prior to their arrival they would have no way of knowing he was in the car unless the driver told them and we don't know that answer. Careful your police hate is really showing.

[JenyEliza]

I don't hate cops.

I hate DIRTY COPS.

And lately it seems we have WAY more of them than the good ones.

Only the cops can do something about that. Police your own. Get rid of the bad eggs and restore the public's trust.

Otherwise, many (if not most) will continue to distrust you all. Just like I do.

And....for the record, it would seem there are more than 2 bad cops in this scenario. They are now looking for "others" involved in this woman's killing.

Throw the book at 'em. Anyone involved. Restore the public trust.

Otherwise, it's just more the same ole same ole, We The People have had to get used to.

What a bunch of horse****.

[JenyEliza]

By the way, I am in the flood zone in GA. We do not have power at our house and won't until we move into our temporary apartment sometime this week. I am posting from a Mexican restaurant where we are having dinner at the moment.

If you don't get prompt replies from me, it is because I don't have ready access to electricity, etc. Be patient.

Matter of fact, we are leaving now as soon as I go to the ladies room and pay the bill! :D

Take care.

Jen

[JediMindTrick]

I don't hate cops.

I hate DIRTY COPS.

And lately it seems we have WAY more of them than the good ones.



:rolleyes:

Once again there are at any given time about 1,000,000 current cops nationwide handling tens of millions of calls every single day. Your ridiculous assertion means that you think at least 666,666 (you said WAY) of them are corrupt and dirty which means that there should be an overabundance of stories about corruption. Given that then you should easily be able to provide thousands upon thousands of stories about dirty cops. Get cracking, I'd like to see this. Oh for sure you can find a few stories now and then but you won't find many. And spare me the whole police protect their own crap because in todays age of video cell phones you can absolutely bet that if it was as widespread as you claim you would be able to find thousands of different incidents. Instead what you'll find are isolated and sporadic incidents.

[FidelisAdMortem]

In reference to post #25 we do police our own. This officer is accused of driving drunk and killing a pedestrian, the responding officers smelled alcohol on his breath and he was arrested. That is the defintion of policing our own in this case.

[JediMindTrick]

In reference to post #25 we do police our own. This officer is accused of driving drunk and killing a pedestrian, the responding officers smelled alcohol on his breath and he was arrested. That is the defintion of policing our own in this case.

Don't confuse her with facts.

[FidelisAdMortem]

Don't confuse her with facts.

I simply post the facts, I cant control others who post in hysteria, I use to engage that hysteria not I just post the same facts and allow them to post in hysteria. Makes it less personal and lets those that read the thread see who the crazy people are on this messageboard are.

[JediMindTrick]

Oh, leaving the scene of a fatal accident.

Failure to render aid.

Open container violations.

Probably a drug violation in there too.

Whatever they can find on the ass, they oughta throw at him.

How's that pal? You wanted an answer....there's several and they haven't a thing to do with rules related to the *******'s job.

There is nothing in the articles indicating that there were open containers. And don't make the naive assumption that because they were drunk there had to be as I speciallize in DUI enforcement so I've got a wee bit of experience in DUI arrests - you only get open containers in about 1/4 of them.

There is nothing about drugs. Your really grasping now.

As to the render aid part, its going to depend on New York State Law. Certainly the officer had a moral obligation to stay which is one of the many reasons his job is going to be toast but legally its not so clear. I'm unfamiliar with New York state law so perhaps Fidelis could enlighten us but I do know that in my state we couldn't charge him since he wasn't the driver.

[FidelisAdMortem]

No charges for the passengers in NYS. However, the offduty officer will be charged for patrol guide violations through the department. A few might be, failure to report police incident involving offduty MOS (failure to dial 911), officer unbecoming, unfit for duty (alcohol consumption - although tough to prove b/c passenger wasnt tested), etc.

[JediMindTrick]

I simply post the facts, I cant control others who post in hysteria, I use to engage that hysteria not I just post the same facts and allow them to post in hysteria. Makes it less personal and lets those that read the thread see who the crazy people are on this messageboard are.

Yep. Nothing like a bad cop story to show you who the cop haters are even if they profess not to be. And yes Jeny you are a cop hater by your own words - you said you hate dirty cops and you then said most cops are dirty. It doesn't get much clearer than that.

[JenyEliza]

In reference to post #25 we do police our own. This officer is accused of driving drunk and killing a pedestrian, the responding officers smelled alcohol on his breath and he was arrested. That is the defintion of policing our own in this case.

Which is why police officer #2 (passenger) was allowed to 1) leave the scene of the "accident" (which was NOT an accident), and 2) allowed to refuse and fail to render aid involving a fatality, and to add insult to injury (fatality actually), allowed to 3) sleep it off at home all night before questioning later today?

Yeah....gotta love that policing your own ****. :rolleyes:

Yeeeee-haw, roll 'em cowboy! :)) :)) :))


I don't think a civie would be allowed nearly the lee-way that Officer #2 was. Do you?

Hmmmmm.....?

Nah. Didn't think so.

[JenyEliza]

No charges for the passengers in NYS. However, the offduty officer will be charged for patrol guide violations through the department. A few might be, failure to report police incident involving offduty MOS (failure to dial 911), officer unbecoming, unfit for duty (alcohol consumption - although tough to prove b/c passenger wasnt tested), etc.

Yeah, interesting. Officer #2 allowed to go home to sleep off the booze---and he wasn't tested first.

I know. I know. I'm just a "cop hater".

Seee....I don't trust the thin blue line as far as I can throw any one of ya'll.

I've seen the utter devastation your cronyism does to innocent lives. I've seen police ruin (financially, emotionally and otherwise) whole INNOCENT families (twice, actually). You guys will NEVER pass the ******** smell test with me, as long as the shenanigans with police continue.

As far as I am concerned, if it doesn't add up (and it doesn't make sense officer #2 was allowed to go home and sleep it off without even a BAC done), then my ****-0-meter is going off full throttle.

Sorry boys.

Clean up your act(s) and maybe that'll change.

[FidelisAdMortem]

A passenger of a vehicle is not required to submit to alcohol testing.

[JediMindTrick]

Which is why police officer #2 (passenger) was allowed to 1) leave the scene of the "accident" (which was NOT an accident), and 2) allowed to refuse and fail to render aid involving a fatality, and to add insult to injury (fatality actually), allowed to 3) sleep it off at home all night before questioning later today?

Yeah....gotta love that policing your own ****. :rolleyes:

Yeeeee-haw, roll 'em cowboy! :)) :)) :))


I don't think a civie would be allowed nearly the lee-way that Officer #2 was. Do you?

Hmmmmm.....?

Nah. Didn't think so.

Do you have a reading comprehension problem? Go back and read the articles and you can see the obvious flaw in your argument. But because you obviously didn't get it the first time I told you this I'll explain in greater detail.

Officer #2 came in the next day to inform the police he was a passenger in the car. Look up the definition of inform since you seem to be struggling with it. The fact that he had to inform them of this shows that the police didn't know he was even involved. In other words, let me make this very simple for you, he fled the scene prior to police arriving. As I already said once in this thread, were the responding officers supposed to use a crystal ball or time machine to go back and see who was in the car at the time?

As I've said many times already his job is toast for what are doubtless numerous policy violations. Fidelis outlined several. But from a criminal standpoint there really isn't anything to get him with. Moral obligation does not equal legal obligation in many cases. He'll also face a civil obligation as no doubt the family of the deceased will sue both he and the driver. But criminally it does not appear he broke the law.

And last but not least. Even if its found he did stick around what were the responding cops supposed to do with him? Be corrupt by making up a charge to arrest him on? Would that satisfy you? He wasn't driving so you can't charge him with DUI. You have to be 21 to be a cop so you can't charge him with drinking alcohol since police are allowed to drink alcohol off duty. As such a breath test as you suggest is irrelevant since it wouldn't mean anything.

[JediMindTrick]

A passenger of a vehicle is not required to submit to alcohol testing.

Uh oh, there you go with facts again.

[FidelisAdMortem]

Uh oh, there you go with facts again.

I will continue to post them.

[JenyEliza]

Do you have a reading comprehension problem?

Ignoring your personal attack and insult. You may get away with talking to people like that on the job, but here, you are an equal player to me and I don't have to take bullying and ******** from you.

Try a different tone and take off your badge (it doesn't work on me here).


Officer #2 came in the next day to inform the police he was a passenger in the car.

Officer #2 (just like a civilian passenter in a fatal "accident") has an OBLIGATION to REMAIN ON THE SCENE of a FATAL ACCIDENT to be interviewed by police AT THE TIME OF THE ACCIDENT.

Officer #2 does NOT get special dispensation to walk home, scott-free to sleep off the booze and then wander into the precinct the next day for an interview--after he's gotten the story straight with all his buddies, ole chums.

That is, unless you're going to hand out that dispensation to every other civvy involved in a fatal accident.

What Officer #2 did is called LEAVING THE SCENE OF AN ACCIDENT. Down here in GA that's a crime. If it involves a fatality, I believe it is of the FELONY variety.

Certainly, if your Officer #2 had *any* shred of decency, dignity or class about his person he would have stayed on the scene---if for no other reason than to render aid as a TRAINED FIRST RESPONDER.

But, he did not.

Your Officer #2 did the same thing a criminal ****-bag would do. He ran and he hid, until he wasn't drunk anymore. He got sober, got is story straight, got lawyered up and then went in for an interview. Nice. :rolleyes:

I'm sure the young woman's family is comforted by this fact tonight at the funeral home.


As I've said many times already his job is toast for what are doubtless numerous policy violations. Fidelis outlined several. But from a criminal standpoint there really isn't anything to get him with. Moral obligation does not equal legal obligation in many cases. He'll also face a civil obligation as no doubt the family of the deceased will sue both he and the driver. But criminally it does not appear he broke the law.

Oh, boo-****ing-hoo. He made the choice to go out and booze it up, then get in the car with his Cop #1 buddy who was boozing it up. They killed someone. He made the choice not to render aid to the dying young woman. He chose to go home and SLEEP.

I'm sorry, I have to bring out the itty-bitty-bitty violins for these cops.

Someone's young daughter is lying on a mortuary slab tonight and that panty-waist ***Profanity Filter Bypass Removed*** couldn't even be bothered to stick around to render aid, much less be interviewed by cops.

That's not the kind of man I want on a police force anywhere. I'm surprised at the cops here defending the actions of Officer #2 (who left the scene of an accident and failed to render aid involving a fatality).

Nope, Officer #2 doesn't get a pass. Sorry.

[JenyEliza]

I continue to remind all that Officer #2:

1. Left the scene of a fatal accident.
2. Was a TRAINED FIRST RESPONDER who *failed to render aid* at said accident.
3. Did not report his involvement in the accident until more than 12 hours had elapsed.
4. Was not given a BAC test, therefore evidence was destroyed.

There are plenty of facts his defenders would prefer to ignore, I'll keep posting them (as I am able to--given my limited ability to connect to power and internet--I am in the GA flood zone).

[JediMindTrick]

Ignoring your personal attack and insult. You may get away with talking to people like that on the job, but here, you are an equal player to me and I don't have to take bullying and ******** from you.

Try a different tone and take off your badge (it doesn't work on me here).




Officer #2 (just like a civilian passenter in a fatal "accident") has an OBLIGATION to REMAIN ON THE SCENE of a FATAL ACCIDENT to be interviewed by police AT THE TIME OF THE ACCIDENT.

Officer #2 does NOT get special dispensation to walk home, scott-free to sleep off the booze and then wander into the precinct the next day for an interview--after he's gotten the story straight with all his buddies, ole chums.

That is, unless you're going to hand out that dispensation to every other civvy involved in a fatal accident.

What Officer #2 did is called LEAVING THE SCENE OF AN ACCIDENT. Down here in GA that's a crime. If it involves a fatality, I believe it is of the FELONY variety.

Certainly, if your Officer #2 had *any* shred of decency, dignity or class about his person he would have stayed on the scene---if for no other reason than to render aid as a TRAINED FIRST RESPONDER.

But, he did not.

Your Officer #2 did the same thing a criminal ****-bag would do. He ran and he hid, until he wasn't drunk anymore. He got sober, got is story straight, got lawyered up and then went in for an interview. Nice. :rolleyes:

I'm sure the young woman's family is comforted by this fact tonight at the funeral home.




Oh, boo-****ing-hoo. He made the choice to go out and booze it up, then get in the car with his Cop #1 buddy who was boozing it up. They killed someone. He made the choice not to render aid to the dying young woman. He chose to go home and SLEEP.

I'm sorry, I have to bring out the itty-bitty-bitty violins for these cops.

Someone's young daughter is lying on a mortuary slab tonight and that panty-waist ass-hole couldn't even be bothered to stick around to render aid, much less be interviewed by cops.

That's not the kind of man I want on a police force anywhere. I'm surprised at the cops here defending the actions of Officer #2 (who left the scene of an accident and failed to render aid involving a fatality).

Nope, Officer #2 doesn't get a pass. Sorry.

Where is anyone defending him? The only thing Fidelis and I have done is point out that there are no criminal charges to file on him. Fidelis is a NYPD officer so I think he's a bit of an expert on New York Law. I'm a bit of an expert on my states law. Both of us have stated that in our states you can't charge passengers with leaving the scene. You can certainly charge a driver but not a passenger.

Both of us have also said many times in this thread that the guy will be fired. Neither of us have said he shouldn't.

And last but not least. You with your history are the last person who should be lecturing anyone about civility especially in a thread you've been littering with filtered swearwords and hate talk about police.

[JediMindTrick]

I continue to remind all that Officer #2:

1. Left the scene of a fatal accident.
2. Was a TRAINED FIRST RESPONDER who *failed to render aid* at said accident.
3. Did not report his involvement in the accident until more than 12 hours had elapsed.
4. Was not given a BAC test, therefore evidence was destroyed.

There are plenty of facts his defenders would prefer to ignore, I'll keep posting them (as I am able to--given my limited ability to connect to power and internet--I am in the GA flood zone).

1. Not a criminal crime.
2. Again not a criminal crime.
3. Again not a criminal crime since he wasn't the driver.
4. He's over 21 so his BAC is utterly and completely irrelevant to anything criminally.

Now each one of these are without a doubt huge policy violations and will be used as reasons to terminate him. And they may well be used in a lawsuit against him. But criminally, not so much.

[FidelisAdMortem]

Leaving the scene of an accident only applies to the operator of the motor vehicle, not to the passengers in NYS.

Failing to render aid/dialing of 911 is not a crime in NYS, however the offduty officer can be brought up on department charges through the NYPD for the infraction.

Failure to repot an offduty accident is not a crime in NYS, however as previously stated he will face department charges for the offense.

A passenger of a vehicle involved in a DWI/DUI will not be given a BAC test unless there is evidence that the person is in fact the driver. The only other time a nondriver is given a BAC test is if the officer on/off duty is involved in a police shooting. The departments procedure is to test the officer, however that is a department procedure, not a NYS enforced law, and applied only to NYPD officers.

[JediMindTrick]

And by the way Jeny, now your arguing against yourself.

First you were arguing that the responding cops were corrupt by not arresting officer #2. Now your arguing that officer #2 fled the scene. You can't have it both ways unless your going to admit you were wrong about many things in this thread.

[JenyEliza]

And by the way Jeny, now your arguing against yourself.

First you were arguing that the responding cops were corrupt by not arresting officer #2. Now your arguing that officer #2 fled the scene. You can't have it both ways unless your going to admit you were wrong about many things in this thread.

I'm not wrong about a damned thing.

Officer #2 should have been arrested on the spot.

Instead (for whatever reason) he was allowed to walk home and sleep it off.

No civilian would have been allowed such leeway involving a fatal accident and DWI.

Why should Officer #2?

And.....since he has now committed crimes (leaving the scene of a fatal accident and failing to render aid, as a trained 1st responder), what charges does he face?

Why none, of course.

And you *wonder* why civilians don't trust ya'll?

Dayam. :doh:

Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that out. :)) :)) :))

Of course, make no mistake, I'm not accusing any cops of being rocket scientists. :doh: :))

[JenyEliza]

1. Not a criminal crime.
2. Again not a criminal crime.
3. Again not a criminal crime since he wasn't the driver.
4. He's over 21 so his BAC is utterly and completely irrelevant to anything criminally.

Now each one of these are without a doubt huge policy violations and will be used as reasons to terminate him. And they may well be used in a lawsuit against him. But criminally, not so much.

I'm sorry, I am laughing SO HARD my sides hurt. :)) :)) :)) :))

WTH is a "criminal crime"?

If a crime isn't CRIMINAL, then what the hell? Why is it a crime?

OMG....you can't make this **** up. TOO ****ING FUNNY!!!!!!

And you wonder why I don't take you seriously? OMG.





ETA: Pretty ****ing scary you're behind a badge and a gun. Not a "criminal crime". :rolleyes: :)) :)) :)) :))

[JenyEliza]

I continue to remind all that Officer #2:

1. Left the scene of a fatal accident.
2. Was a TRAINED FIRST RESPONDER who *failed to render aid* at said accident.
3. Did not report his involvement in the accident until more than 12 hours had elapsed.
4. Was not given a BAC test, therefore evidence was destroyed.

There are plenty of facts his defenders would prefer to ignore, I'll keep posting them (as I am able to--given my limited ability to connect to power and internet--I am in the GA flood zone).

What's funny is this.....excepting the 1st responder status, all of the above could have been said about good old Teddy Kennedy.

And those who are here defending Officer #2 have railed and raised hell about TK and his fatal accident for years.

Hypocrisy is thy name.

At least I am consistent. I hold TK and Officer #2 to the SAME standards of decent human and ethical behavior.

Some however, play footloose and fancy free when it involves their friends and lapses of character.

Whatever. Some things never change. :doh: :rolleyes:

[JediMindTrick]

I'm sorry, I am laughing SO HARD my sides hurt. :)) :)) :)) :))

WTH is a "criminal crime"?

If a crime isn't CRIMINAL, then what the hell? Why is it a crime?

OMG....you can't make this **** up. TOO ****ING FUNNY!!!!!!

And you wonder why I don't take you seriously? OMG.





ETA: Pretty ****ing scary you're behind a badge and a gun. Not a "criminal crime". :rolleyes: :)) :)) :)) :))

Here is law lesson #1 for you.

Some laws are civil, some are criminal. Examples: landlord tenant laws, workplace laws, divorce laws, child custody laws are civil laws. Battery, murder, leaving the scene of an accident are criminal crimes. Breaking laws in either area is considered illegal and thus a crime but they are different types of crime. When I say someone broke a criminal crime I'm referring to criminal laws broken, not civil. Police are only empowered to enforce criminal laws. You can violate civil laws all you want and the police can't do a thing about it. There are limited exceptions in that sheriff's departments have the power to enforce certain civil laws if so ordered by a judge.

And once again you keep ignoring what Fidelis and I are telling. It is not criminally illegal for a passenger to leave the scene of an accident. It may well by civilly illegal though in that because of his first responder status he might be held liable in civil court but that doesn't make it criminally illegal. And as I just explained to you police cannot enforce civil laws. Therefore whether officer #2 left with permission or left before other officers arrived is irrelevant because he did nothing that the police could arrest him for.

This isn't exactly an unique situation. As police we deal with hit and run accidents all the time and many times there are passengers. And each and every time we can only charge the driver. The fact that passenger in this case was a police officer does not somehow change the law.

[JediMindTrick]

What's funny is this.....excepting the 1st responder status, all of the above could have been said about good old Teddy Kennedy.

And those who are here defending Officer #2 have railed and raised hell about TK and his fatal accident for years.

Hypocrisy is thy name.

At least I am consistent. I hold TK and Officer #2 to the SAME standards of decent human and ethical behavior.

Some however, play footloose and fancy free when it involves their friends and lapses of character.

Whatever. Some things never change. :doh: :rolleyes:

Ted Kennedy was the driver. Officer #2 was a passenger. From a criminal law standpoint that makes all the difference. Morally not so much.

And your either having some serious reading comprehension or your lying because at no point have Fidelis or I defended Officer #2. We have defended the responding officers but not officer #2 yet you keep claiming we are defending him.

[JenyEliza]

Here is law lesson #1 for you.

Some laws are civil, some are criminal. Examples: landlord tenant laws, workplace laws, divorce laws, child custody laws are civil laws. Battery, murder, leaving the scene of an accident are criminal crimes. Breaking laws in either area is considered illegal and thus a crime but they are different types of crime. When I say someone broke a criminal crime I'm referring to criminal laws broken, not civil. Police are only empowered to enforce criminal laws. You can violate civil laws all you want and the police can't do a thing about it. There are limited exceptions in that sheriff's departments have the power to enforce certain civil laws if so ordered by a judge.

And once again you keep ignoring what Fidelis and I are telling. It is not criminally illegal for a passenger to leave the scene of an accident. It may well by civilly illegal though in that because of his first responder status he might be held liable in civil court but that doesn't make it criminally illegal. And as I just explained to you police cannot enforce civil laws. Therefore whether officer #2 left with permission or left before other officers arrived is irrelevant because he did nothing that the police could arrest him for.

This isn't exactly an unique situation. As police we deal with hit and run accidents all the time and many times there are passengers. And each and every time we can only charge the driver. The fact that passenger in this case was a police officer does not somehow change the law.

I'm sorry, I'm having a really hard time taking you seriously. You absolutely slaughtered your credibility with that "not criminal crime" ****. :))

Not that I should have to point this out to a so-called officer of the law, but point in fact there are two variations on the law:

1. Criminal
2. Civil

If you are trying to say officer #2 committed some civil infraction, you've done a pretty ham-handed job of it. I'd *love* to see you explaining this "not a criminal crime" thing to a Judge while on the stand as a witness for the NYPD.

OMG. I am STILL laughing my ass off.

"Criminal crime". :)) :)) :))

WTH.....? :))

My (civil, not criminal) attorney (handling my financial matters) is gonna enjoy that one coming from a cop. :doh: :))

Can't wait to relate this story to him when we talk next week.

Jesus, Mary and Joseph---and the wee damned donkey too!!!! :)) :)) :))

[JenyEliza]

Wow. This story has made it all the way to Australia.

Interesting. This article seems to support my position here entirely.

These cops are scum-sucker, bottom-feeder, ass-covering, knuckle-dragging butt munchers.

And that's putting it KINDLY!!!!!

http://www.news.com.au/perthnow/story/0,21598,26134995-950,00.html


A DRUNK policeman who mowed down a woman has been arrested - but his passengers who fled the scene may escape charges.

New York policeman Andrew Kelly has been charged over the 33-year-old Vionique Valnord's death after allegedly hitting her with his Jeep, the New York Post reports (http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/drunk_cop_kills_pastor_daughter_SSFyPwRB13876Qr3gY 9uKP).

A second off-duty cop, who was in the front passenger seat at the time of the accident, fled the scene while the pastor's daughter, who had just been at a wedding, lay dying in the Brooklyn street.

Two other passengers reportedly fled the scene as well.

NYPD Commissioner Ray Kelly said the officer in the passenger seat reported to his regular precinct hours later and told his superiors that he was in the car.

"He's being questioned about the circumstances of the accident," the commissioner said.

But a lawyer said that leaving the scene of an accident was only a crime for drivers.

"I have never heard of it applying to anyone else but the driver," lawyer Steven Chaikin told the Post.

Ricardo Brisard, who was at the scene, said Valnord was still alive when the passengers fled.

"She was breathing slowly," Mr Brisard said.

"She was hit on the right side. Her right leg was broken. She was still alive."

They left this woman for dead, while they covered their asses.

Good going, NYPD!! Hooo-rah!!! What heroes you have working the beat mowing down young women and then hiding while they get their **** together. Good job. Well done and all that rot. :rolleyes: :clap:

[FidelisAdMortem]

That article affirms what Ive said this entire thread in regards to charges and who they apply to.

[JenyEliza]

Good...and it absolutely reinforces for me that every single stinking cop involved in this CYA is a scum-sucking, bottom-feeding, ass-covering, knuckle-dragging butt muncher.

And I think I'm being very charitable with those descriptors for these jerks.

DRUNK POLICE OFFICERS hit a woman and left a LIVING HUMAN for DEAD in the street.

"To Serve and Protect" takes on a new meaning in this light.

That's some scary ****, there.

Glad I don't live in NYC and won't ever bother to visit either.

Not with these guys on the job. No thanks.

[DLaw911]

Throw him under the jail. I have ZERO tolerance for drunk drivers. ZERO.

Cops or not.

We'll see how hard this creep's hand gets smacked, I'm betting not hard. *shrug*The standard for driving under the influence is not "drunk" but substantial impairment. In this case, reading the article, the officer refused to provide a breath test and a blood was obtained. We don't know the resutls (at least I don't). This could be a hit and run without DUI.

Especially since: Investigators believe the night's rain and fog played a role in the crash and that Kelly may have never seen Valnord.

[JenyEliza]

More:


A drunk NYPD officer struck and killed a Brooklyn woman early this morning - and his three passengers, including at least one other cop, fled the deadly scene and left her dying in the street, police sources and witnesses said.

Driver Andrew Kelly, 30, who is assigned to the 68th Precinct in Bay Ridge and lives in Flushing, Queens, was arrested after mowing down Vionique Valnord, 33 at the corner of Avenue N and 56th Street, cops said.

Sources said he refused to take a breathalyzer test and investigators obtained a warrant to draw his blood.

A second off-duty cop in the front passenger seat and two more in the rear bolted immediately following the deadly collision, sources said.

Such outrageous behavior from those who "protect us from ourselves" (I believe it was you, FAM, who insinuated earlier today that an honored guest needs to be protected from himself by LE).

I would posit, that it is we mere mortal citizens who need to be protected from the Constabulary, rather than the other way around.

Seems some cops like to play dodge cars with citizens bodies in the street. It would seem some cops believe themselves to be above the law.

[Stuball]

Good...and it absolutely reinforces for me that every single stinking cop involved in this CYA is a scum-sucking, bottom-feeding, ass-covering, knuckle-dragging butt muncher.

And I think I'm being very charitable with those descriptors for these jerks.

DRUNK POLICE OFFICERS hit a woman and left a LIVING HUMAN for DEAD in the street.

"To Serve and Protect" takes on a new meaning in this light.

That's some scary ****, there.

Glad I don't live in NYC and won't ever bother to visit either.

Not with these guys on the job. No thanks.
Gee How will NYC ever survive without your visit?

[JediMindTrick]

More:



Such outrageous behavior from those who "protect us from ourselves" (I believe it was you, FAM, who insinuated earlier today that an honored guest needs to be protected from himself by LE).

I would posit, that it is we mere mortal citizens who need to be protected from the Constabulary, rather than the other way around.

Seems some cops like to play dodge cars with citizens bodies in the street. It would seem some cops believe themselves to be above the law.

So given your new articles are you ready to admit you were WRONG and that you falsely accused the responding officers of corruption. All your new articles talk about how the passengers fled the scene which means (do I need to use small words for you to comprehend this since you haven't gotten it yet) that they were no longer there when the responding officers got there.

This means you were ABSOLUTELY WRONG when you claimed:

1) The responding officers let the passengers off easy (the passengers were gone )
2) The responding officers failed to give the passengers a breath test (can't give breath tests to passengers who aren't there)
3) The responding officers were involved in a CYA (the passengers arrested the person who was there)
4) The responding officers did anything wrong (what else could they have done besides arrest the driver)

The officers actually involved in the wreck are scum and they all deserve to be fired. The driver needs to go to prison for a long time. I'd love to charge the ones who fled but as I keep saying and as your articles point out, they didn't break the law.

I've been consistent in this thread in that I've defended the responding officers and merely pointed out what could happen to the officers who were involved in the wreck. You've only been consistent in your police hatred and your uncanny ability to ignore the facts of the case and to ignore what Fidelis and I have actually said.

[JenyEliza]

Jedi....if I had time and the bandwidth and battery pack left, I would open a thread in the mod forum for your incivility.

As it stands, I have much bigger fish to fry than the likes of you so I'm not going to.

Like I said, you may get away talking to the citizens on your beat that way, but here you don't wear a badge and you're no better and no more powerful than anyone else here.

Put your badge down and drop the attitude and I might. Might. Reengage you.

Otherwise, I'll put this in little words you will understand--just for you. Good-bye.

[super cool ski instructor]

Wow...ummm......:shifty:

[JediMindTrick]

Jedi....if I had time and the bandwidth and battery pack left, I would open a thread in the mod forum for your incivility.

As it stands, I have much bigger fish to fry than the likes of you so I'm not going to.

Like I said, you may get away talking to the citizens on your beat that way, but here you don't wear a badge and you're no better and no more powerful than anyone else here.

Put your badge down and drop the attitude and I might. Might. Reengage you.

Otherwise, I'll put this in little words you will understand--just for you. Good-bye.

Translation: rather than admit you were wrong about much of this thread, your going to go away. Just as good since you were filling the thread with nonsense.

[FidelisAdMortem]

Update: Blood test comes back. 0.0

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/tests_reveal_dwi_cop_had_blood_alcohol_QShLKRQHL2Y BRwnEC0O5MP

[jimjames418]

Update: Blood test comes back. 0.0

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/tests_reveal_dwi_cop_had_blood_alcohol_QShLKRQHL2Y BRwnEC0O5MP
From the article.
He refused a Breathalyzer test at the scene.
I don't know about New York but in Michigan a refusal to take a breathalyzer test is considered an admission of intoxication in a case such as this.

[angelicmadrigal]

This could be a hit and run without DUI.


Which is still a bad thing.

Either way he still was responsible for causing someone's death with a vehicle and left the scene.

[RogerDodger]

Of course, the test was administered seven hours after the incident.

[Remus Lupin]

Jeny,
I'm going to tell you flat out:
BACK OFF!

Yes what the cop did was wrong, but most police officers I know are honest hard working people.
There are a few bad apples, but I have about as much respect for our police as I do
our military.

[neoINDIE]

I don't hate cops.

I hate DIRTY COPS.

And lately it seems we have WAY more of them than the good ones.

Only the cops can do something about that. Police your own. Get rid of the bad eggs and restore the public's trust.

Otherwise, many (if not most) will continue to distrust you all. Just like I do.

And....for the record, it would seem there are more than 2 bad cops in this scenario. They are now looking for "others" involved in this woman's killing.

Throw the book at 'em. Anyone involved. Restore the public trust.

Otherwise, it's just more the same ole same ole, We The People have had to get used to.

What a bunch of horse****.

Idiotic.

You only hear about the bad ones. You don't hear about the good ones, out there protecting your ass and getting zero appreciation from you.

Thats OK though, it isn't necessary.

[gdoane]

Reading through this mess, I reach a couple of conclusions:

Not one cop here has EVER defended the act of DUI or any crime like hit and run.

Nor should they.

The question about failing to render aid... BUT...

Really? A drunk cop should be rendering aid? Yeah, I want CPR from THAT guy! NOT!!! Like Clint Eastwood said, "a man has got to know his limitations."

I haven't seen anything but universal condemnation for the passenger cop either. Ask any cop, ask any reasonable person, and his ass is fired. It doesn't matter if he was drunk or not, on duty or off duty, he saw a crime and did nothing about it. That's dereliction of duty, so he's fired. I would be AMAZED if he still has a job by the time you read this post.

I'm not a cop. I work with cops all the time, being a Motorola factory trained comm tech and more than a few cops carry Motorola gear on their belts and in their cruisers. I've dealt with hundreds if not thousands of cops and the ones I deal with are stone cold serious about their job because they want to live through the day and go home in one piece. They don't want dirty cops anymore than anybody else does because you gotta trust the guy who has your back.

I see the hit and run as a felony charge. Alcohol may be a factor or not, but that really doesn't matter as the driver is going down for a felony. Hit and run with a fatality is at LEAST a manslaughter charge.

The passenger didn't do anything wrong as a civilian. As an officer, he's fired. Civilians can witness crimes and leave because they're not breaking any oath to uphold the law, but officers don't enjoy that because they're sworn.

The ONLY reason the passenger is liable to be fired is because he took an oath and he broke it. Criminal charges are unlikely. Hope the guy has other skills because not even the Army would take him after this screwup.

[JediMindTrick]

Reading through this mess, I reach a couple of conclusions:

Not one cop here has EVER defended the act of DUI or any crime like hit and run.

Nor should they.

The question about failing to render aid... BUT...

Really? A drunk cop should be rendering aid? Yeah, I want CPR from THAT guy! NOT!!! Like Clint Eastwood said, "a man has got to know his limitations."

I haven't seen anything but universal condemnation for the passenger cop either. Ask any cop, ask any reasonable person, and his ass is fired. It doesn't matter if he was drunk or not, on duty or off duty, he saw a crime and did nothing about it. That's dereliction of duty, so he's fired. I would be AMAZED if he still has a job by the time you read this post.

I'm not a cop. I work with cops all the time, being a Motorola factory trained comm tech and more than a few cops carry Motorola gear on their belts and in their cruisers. I've dealt with hundreds if not thousands of cops and the ones I deal with are stone cold serious about their job because they want to live through the day and go home in one piece. They don't want dirty cops anymore than anybody else does because you gotta trust the guy who has your back.

I see the hit and run as a felony charge. Alcohol may be a factor or not, but that really doesn't matter as the driver is going down for a felony. Hit and run with a fatality is at LEAST a manslaughter charge.

The passenger didn't do anything wrong as a civilian. As an officer, he's fired. Civilians can witness crimes and leave because they're not breaking any oath to uphold the law, but officers don't enjoy that because they're sworn.

The ONLY reason the passenger is liable to be fired is because he took an oath and he broke it. Criminal charges are unlikely. Hope the guy has other skills because not even the Army would take him after this screwup.

Its refreshing to see a poster who gets it.

At no point have Fidelis or I defended either the driver or the cop who fled. We've merely pointed out that legally there is nothing to charge the cop who fled with. The only cops we've defended are the ones who responded and didn't allow the blue line to get in the way of doing their job and arrested the driver. And we've both said that the cop who fled is almost certainly going to get fired.

[Greyclouds]

Reading through this mess, I reach a couple of conclusions:

Not one cop here has EVER defended the act of DUI or any crime like hit and run.

Nor should they.

The question about failing to render aid... BUT...

Really? A drunk cop should be rendering aid? Yeah, I want CPR from THAT guy! NOT!!! Like Clint Eastwood said, "a man has got to know his limitations."

I haven't seen anything but universal condemnation for the passenger cop either. Ask any cop, ask any reasonable person, and his ass is fired. It doesn't matter if he was drunk or not, on duty or off duty, he saw a crime and did nothing about it. That's dereliction of duty, so he's fired. I would be AMAZED if he still has a job by the time you read this post.

I'm not a cop. I work with cops all the time, being a Motorola factory trained comm tech and more than a few cops carry Motorola gear on their belts and in their cruisers. I've dealt with hundreds if not thousands of cops and the ones I deal with are stone cold serious about their job because they want to live through the day and go home in one piece. They don't want dirty cops anymore than anybody else does because you gotta trust the guy who has your back.

I see the hit and run as a felony charge. Alcohol may be a factor or not, but that really doesn't matter as the driver is going down for a felony. Hit and run with a fatality is at LEAST a manslaughter charge.

The passenger didn't do anything wrong as a civilian. As an officer, he's fired. Civilians can witness crimes and leave because they're not breaking any oath to uphold the law, but officers don't enjoy that because they're sworn.

The ONLY reason the passenger is liable to be fired is because he took an oath and he broke it. Criminal charges are unlikely. Hope the guy has other skills because not even the Army would take him after this screwup.

I... I... agree...? :eek:

More seriously, excellent points, Gdoane.

[sircharliebrown]

Ignoring your personal attack and insult. You may get away with talking to people like that on the job, but here, you are an equal player to me and I don't have to take bullying and ******** from you.

Try a different tone and take off your badge (it doesn't work on me here).




Officer #2 (just like a civilian passenter in a fatal "accident") has an OBLIGATION to REMAIN ON THE SCENE of a FATAL ACCIDENT to be interviewed by police AT THE TIME OF THE ACCIDENT.

Officer #2 does NOT get special dispensation to walk home, scott-free to sleep off the booze and then wander into the precinct the next day for an interview--after he's gotten the story straight with all his buddies, ole chums.

That is, unless you're going to hand out that dispensation to every other civvy involved in a fatal accident.

What Officer #2 did is called LEAVING THE SCENE OF AN ACCIDENT. Down here in GA that's a crime. If it involves a fatality, I believe it is of the FELONY variety.

Certainly, if your Officer #2 had *any* shred of decency, dignity or class about his person he would have stayed on the scene---if for no other reason than to render aid as a TRAINED FIRST RESPONDER.

But, he did not.

Your Officer #2 did the same thing a criminal ****-bag would do. He ran and he hid, until he wasn't drunk anymore. He got sober, got is story straight, got lawyered up and then went in for an interview. Nice. :rolleyes:

I'm sure the young woman's family is comforted by this fact tonight at the funeral home.




Oh, boo-****ing-hoo. He made the choice to go out and booze it up, then get in the car with his Cop #1 buddy who was boozing it up. They killed someone. He made the choice not to render aid to the dying young woman. He chose to go home and SLEEP.

I'm sorry, I have to bring out the itty-bitty-bitty violins for these cops.

Someone's young daughter is lying on a mortuary slab tonight and that panty-waist **profanity filter bypass removed couldn't even be bothered to stick around to render aid, much less be interviewed by cops.

That's not the kind of man I want on a police force anywhere. I'm surprised at the cops here defending the actions of Officer #2 (who left the scene of an accident and failed to render aid involving a fatality).

Nope, Officer #2 doesn't get a pass. Sorry.

Wow. Cop-hating much?

Contrary to what you claim, I don't see anyone in here defending or making excuses for what either of these cops did.

Nice filter bypass, btw.

:rolleyes:

[FidelisAdMortem]

Reading through this mess, I reach a couple of conclusions:

Not one cop here has EVER defended the act of DUI or any crime like hit and run.

Nor should they.

The question about failing to render aid... BUT...

Really? A drunk cop should be rendering aid? Yeah, I want CPR from THAT guy! NOT!!! Like Clint Eastwood said, "a man has got to know his limitations."

I haven't seen anything but universal condemnation for the passenger cop either. Ask any cop, ask any reasonable person, and his ass is fired. It doesn't matter if he was drunk or not, on duty or off duty, he saw a crime and did nothing about it. That's dereliction of duty, so he's fired. I would be AMAZED if he still has a job by the time you read this post.

I'm not a cop. I work with cops all the time, being a Motorola factory trained comm tech and more than a few cops carry Motorola gear on their belts and in their cruisers. I've dealt with hundreds if not thousands of cops and the ones I deal with are stone cold serious about their job because they want to live through the day and go home in one piece. They don't want dirty cops anymore than anybody else does because you gotta trust the guy who has your back.

I see the hit and run as a felony charge. Alcohol may be a factor or not, but that really doesn't matter as the driver is going down for a felony. Hit and run with a fatality is at LEAST a manslaughter charge.

The passenger didn't do anything wrong as a civilian. As an officer, he's fired. Civilians can witness crimes and leave because they're not breaking any oath to uphold the law, but officers don't enjoy that because they're sworn.

The ONLY reason the passenger is liable to be fired is because he took an oath and he broke it. Criminal charges are unlikely. Hope the guy has other skills because not even the Army would take him after this screwup.

Exactly.

[plsd2mechu]

WOW!!!!

is this what happenes when most of the libs get kicked off the board?

[plsd2mechu]

yo jung!!!????!?!?????????????

get back to earning XP!

[plsd2mechu]

and BTW....

Moof is just TOO ****ing adorable!

Imma put some tartar sauce on him and eat him UP!!!!

[Sinister Rouge]

Sounds like the passenger will be applying for some unemployment soon. Maybe he could fill out an application for an Arby's.
It also sounds like the driver will be very popular in the state penitentiary... ;-)

[sircharliebrown]

and BTW....

Moof is just TOO ****ing adorable!

Imma put some tartar sauce on him and eat him UP!!!!

He got his first tooth on Monday!

[nick21ia]

The idiocy in this thread is astounding. What could the responding cops do besides arrest the driver when he was the only there? It is not a crime to leave the scene as passenger. Some people need to take their idiot glasses off and start reading and understanding the facts.

[tha malcontent™]

WOW!!!!

is this what happenes when most of the libs get kicked off the board?

When is that going to Happen?... :))

If this place Sucks so Bad, why don't you Quit?...

:)

peace...

[JenyEliza]

Jeny,
I'm going to tell you flat out:
BACK OFF!

Under what authority do you make this threat? As a police officer? A moderator? An honored guest?

Back off--or else what? Please clarify for me so that I know what step you will take if I fail to heed your threat, because I am NEVER going to "back off" the pressure to get rid of BAD COPS. Ever. Your threat notwithstanding.

So...would appreicate your clarifiying your intentions with that "I'm going to tell you flat out: BACK OFF" threat.

I don't take threats lightly or kindly.

I would imagine you wouldn't appreciate such a post from me directed at you either.

Of course, I would *never* make such a post. I know better. I would be reported and sanctioned for it pretty damned quickly.


Yes what the cop did was wrong, but most police officers I know are honest hard working people.
There are a few bad apples, but I have about as much respect for our police as I do
our military.

I deeply respect our military.

I also deeply respect HONEST, HARD WORKING, *GOOD* COPS, and I know there are many.

But I also know there are TOO MANY bad ones as well. Get rid of them, and you have my 10,000% support and undying and unreserved respect for ALL COPS.

Keep the bad ones on the force....and I can't support them ALL.

Only the GOOD ones.

I don't know how much more plainly I can say that.

Now....what is it you were saying about "BACK OFF"?

[tinydancer]

It is just getting to be really hurtful for you to post such malice towards our law enforcement.
Yes I think I was in the right telling you to "back off". I wasn't threatening you or anything. Just merely asking to take a step back and realize what you are saying.
I don't mean to come across as rude but I had to say it and trust me, I was being nice compared to what I really wanted to say.
I wouldn't find it one bit offensive if somebody said it towards me. I tend to shoot my mouth off and there are are many who do tell me to "back off" on here and I never report them and usually they are right in telling me so.

They way you been posting about our men and women in law enforcement seems to me you hate cops in general at least in my observation (to be fair my observations are sometimes flawed).
Most of our police force are hard working people for low pay put their life on the line to keep you safe. You have no idea apparently what it is like to have a family who worries if their husbean/father/wife/mother goes to work on the street if it will be the final time they will see him/her alive.
I have nothing against you personally Jeny, and I share alot of your views regarding crimes against our kids and so on.
But I find what you said regarding our police force to be extremely hurtful.
I don't care if you trashed lawyers, auto mechanics (I'm going to college to become one), but I DO CARE if you trashed our police force and military.
I agree that there are bad apples in the force. I got news for you, THERE ARE BAD APPLES IN ALL PROFFESIONS.

I know for me, this situation we are all dealing with "great cops only great cops" hurts like hell these days.

I grew up thinking there was never such a thing as a bad cop. Ed Sullivan was my hero as well:dance:And the hottest guy on tv was a choice between little Joe or Hoss.

Then I really grew up.

I think it really hurts people of my generation that really never believed (yes I know it's crazy) but it really really hurts when there is a bad cop.

And I think we are far more judgemental sp? because of it.

Don't mean to be. But that's the way we are.

[JediMindTrick]

I think it really hurts people of my generation that really never believed (yes I know it's crazy) but it really really hurts when there is a bad cop.



This is the crux of your post and whats ironic is that the % of bad cop and bad acts by cops is miniscule today compared to what it was just 30 years ago. I listen to the old timers on my department talk and the things they would routinely do back in the old days would land a guy in prison today. The scandals of the early 90's really changed police work for the better and todays cops are by in large very professional and very rarely abuse their powers. This is why cops like Fidelis and I, both of whom started our tours after the change, get so frustrated when people label "most cops as dirty" as Jeny did in this thread (I started in 1996 and I'm in the upper 1/3 now seniority wise on my department meaning the dinosaurs are few and far between). There will of course be bad apples, there are 1,000,000 cops nationwide so how can there not be, so the real test of todays police is looking at how their agencies and fellow officers respond when a bad incident happens. In this case and in all the others that have made this board recently what you've seen is a highly professional and ethical response by the officers who are investigating their brethren.

In a way this is like the catholic priest scandal. The catholic church was very complicit in coddling and protecting molester priests at one point but the scandals broke and they church changed for the better. Police work is much the same in that in the old days there were many things that police did that were overlooked. If someone said "most priests are molesters" would a current catholic be defensive? Yet some are too quick to say "most cops are dirty."

[Seanachie]

I heard on 77 WABC news radio today (while listening to Sean's radio show) that the Officer has been indicted.


The following link to Newsday.com confirms it;

http://www.newsday.com/news/new-york/da-nypd-cop-indicted-in-fatal-drunken-driving-crash-1.1523673

[JediMindTrick]

The issues in this case now are:

1) Was the officer drunk? Thats going to be hotly contested since the blood test came back .00.

2) Was the officer at fault in the accident? Even if he was drunk it does not automatically mean he was at fault. If your a drunk driver and and someone else causes the accident and dies the drunk is the one who gets hammered.

[Seanachie]

Hello JediMT,

I'm quite sure there will be many issues besides these. I'm also sure a Jury or a Judge (if indeed NY Criminal Law in this case allows a defendant to opt out of a jury trial) will have access to every last bit of detail (that we certainly won't unless we sit through the entire trial) and They or He/She will arrive at a just verdict. I'm a firm believer in innocent till proven guilty despite forgetting this at times and doing the arm-chair Quarterback routine. I try as best I can to avoid doing that.

Whether one is satisfied with the outcome is quite another story.

Be well and safe,

Jim

[smyrna]

I didn't read where this officer drove on the sidewalk. The lady that was hit, was standing in the street. The article said he didn't try to stop so he just didn't see her. The video shows it to be raining, at night and foggy. I can understand that, even if alcohol was not involved. I believe I read where he immediately tried to resuscitate her also.

It would appear by his refusal of a breathalizer that he thought he was drunk and should be treated as such. He'll pay dearly but not as much as the deceased. This is a true tragedy.

This article was not neutral, it was written in an inflamatory, biased way, against this officer. Many who posted, bought into the journalists conveyed feelings and ignored the facts of the case.

To all of the passengers who ran...you are pure slimeballs.