Conservative Teacher Hypocrisy

[demalltheway]

I have a brother-in-law that is a staunch conservative. Obviously from my name you can guess that I’m liberal, actually I very left of liberal. Anyway my brother-in-law does nothing but complain about social programs and how Obama is moving the nation to a socialist state.

I just do not understand the hypocrisy, he is making an excellent living from one of the biggest social programs. I’m forced (have no kids) to pay in excess $6,500 a year out of my property taxes to support the school systems and teachers. He belongs to a Union. He has incredible benefits including fully paid health care and full pension. He gets to do crazy things that we in the private sector would never think about such as carrying over unused vacation days year after year.

It just does not seem right.

[WreckedParty]

I have a brother-in-law that is a staunch conservative. Obviously from my name you can guess that I’m liberal, actually I very left of liberal. Anyway my brother-in-law does nothing but complain about social programs and how Obama is moving the nation to a socialist state.

I just do not understand the hypocrisy, he is making an excellent living from one of the biggest social programs. I’m forced (have no kids) to pay in excess $6,500 a year out of my property taxes to support the school systems and teachers. He belongs to a Union. He has incredible benefits including fully paid health care and full pension. He gets to do crazy things that we in the private sector would never think about such as carrying over unused vacation days year after year.

It just does not seem right.

Guess it would depend on what programs hes complaining about. Since hes working as a teacher, some of the things hes earning. Although what your describing does raise questions like the mad benefits O.O.

[Apatriot]

I have a brother-in-law that is a staunch conservative. Obviously from my name you can guess that I’m liberal, actually I very left of liberal. Anyway my brother-in-law does nothing but complain about social programs and how Obama is moving the nation to a socialist state.

I just do not understand the hypocrisy, he is making an excellent living from one of the biggest social programs. I’m forced (have no kids) to pay in excess $6,500 a year out of my property taxes to support the school systems and teachers. He belongs to a Union. He has incredible benefits including fully paid health care and full pension. He gets to do crazy things that we in the private sector would never think about such as carrying over unused vacation days year after year.

It just does not seem right.

Well, sounds like you chose the wrong profession, or you need to reconsider if you're really a liberal. It sounds like a case of liberal hypocrisy to me. You should be happy that your brother is spending his life teaching kds. You should be proud to pay school taxes. You should be proud that the government gives him adequate health care and a good pension. If all that bothers you, maybe you're really not a liberal.

[demalltheway]

Well, sounds like you chose the wrong profession, or you need to reconsider if you're really a liberal. It sounds like a case of liberal hypocrisy to me. You should be happy that your brother is spending his life teaching kds. You should be proud to pay school taxes. You should be proud that the government gives him adequate health care and a good pension. If all that bothers you, maybe you're really not a liberal.


You are correct, I have no major problem supporting education. More power to my brother-in-law. But how can you complain about social programs when you earn your living from a social program, even one that was does not work so well.

[Apatriot]

You are correct, I have no major problem supporting education. More power to my brother-in-law. But how can you complain about social programs when you earn your living from a social program, even one that was does not work so well.


It depends on your theory of government. I am a conservative. The only democratic party candidate for major office that I've voted for is Zell Miller, when he ran for governor of GA in the early 1990s. However, I do think that schools are an essential part of state and local government's responsibility. (none of the feds' responsibility). The difference between schools and a lot of other social programs, is that 1) the schools are for all, not just the poor and 2) the school's purpose is to produce effective citizens, most social programs end up crippling people by providing a safety net for deliberately wrong choices made.

[ritterbug]

I agree with Apatriot.
Your brother in law puts the education of children above politics. It is for the greater good.

[demalltheway]

I agree with Apatriot.
Your brother in law puts the education of children above politics. It is for the greater good.


Thanks folks, great points.

[demalltheway]

I agree with Apatriot.
Your brother in law puts the education of children above politics. It is for the greater good.


Actually I think he took the job for the summers off. At least that is what he claims. Lol

[RWReaganfan]

I have a brother-in-law that is a staunch conservative. Obviously from my name you can guess that I’m liberal, actually I very left of liberal. Anyway my brother-in-law does nothing but complain about social programs and how Obama is moving the nation to a socialist state.

I just do not understand the hypocrisy, he is making an excellent living from one of the biggest social programs. I’m forced (have no kids) to pay in excess $6,500 a year out of my property taxes to support the school systems and teachers. He belongs to a Union. He has incredible benefits including fully paid health care and full pension. He gets to do crazy things that we in the private sector would never think about such as carrying over unused vacation days year after year.
It just does not seem right.

Something smells fishy!

Fully paid health care? For him or his family too?

Full pension? What do you mean "full pension"?

Vacation days? Since when do teachers get vacation days? I think you mean sick days.

[Apatriot]

Something smells fishy!

Fully paid health care? For him or his family too?

Full pension? What do you mean "full pension"?

Vacation days? Since when do teachers get vacation days? I think you mean sick days.


Teachers get sick days. In many states, a certain number of them can be used for "personal" days for any reason. When I worked in GA, that was 2 days. In AL, it was 3 days. My wife here in FL, gets 6 personal days. The sick days build up (i.e. any of the unused personal days become sick days)

[Celtic Pax]

Something smells fishy!

Fully paid health care? For him or his family too?

Full pension? What do you mean "full pension"?

Vacation days? Since when do teachers get vacation days? I think you mean sick days.The benefits mentioned depend on state and local communities. In Maine, teacher (in public schools) get full medical for self (usually) and pay steep extra for family members BUT that varies from community to community. "Full pensions" are part of the Maine State Retirement System in Maine and after so many years ( not sure exact number) they get vested for full retirement. Maine teachers usually get federal holidays off, week or so vacation for Christmas, February (winter vacation), April (Spring vacation or "mud" season) and of summer vacation from about the 3rd week in June to the 3rd week in August or there abouts. Of course they also get about 14 sick days and 3 personal days (sick days roll over if not used and added to the next years sick days). sick and personal days vary depending on school system. While teachers get "summer vacation" it is rare that teachers actually take the whole time off from work as many usually work summers (teaching and non-teaching jobs) AND often take college classes for re-certification requirements. Some would say that summer vacation is really convalescent leave :dance:as teachers are not paid for that time but paid only for the months they work (payments stretched out over 26 bi-weekly payments).

Teaching for 175 days a year with up to 130+ students (in various classes except elementary schools) is a very stressful job indeed. Most parents can't deal with 1-3kids 6.5 hours a day much less 15 - 25+ per class each day. Throw in staff meetings, PET meetings, curriculum meetings, parent meetings etc. and most good teachers NEED the time off and really use those sick days.

[demalltheway]

The benefits mentioned depend on state and local communities. In Maine, teacher (in public schools) get full medical for self (usually) and pay steep extra for family members BUT that varies from community to community. "Full pensions" are part of the Maine State Retirement System in Maine and after so many years ( not sure exact number) they get vested for full retirement. Maine teachers usually get federal holidays off, week or so vacation for Christmas, February (winter vacation), April (Spring vacation or "mud" season) and of summer vacation from about the 3rd week in June to the 3rd week in August or there abouts. Of course they also get about 14 sick days and 3 personal days (sick days roll over if not used and added to the next years sick days). sick and personal days vary depending on school system. While teachers get "summer vacation" it is rare that teachers actually take the whole time off from work as many usually work summers (teaching and non-teaching jobs) AND often take college classes for re-certification requirements. Some would say that summer vacation is really convalescent leave :dance:as teachers are not paid for that time but paid only for the months they work (payments stretched out over 26 bi-weekly payments).

Teaching for 175 days a year with up to 130+ students (in various classes except elementary schools) is a very stressful job indeed. Most parents can't deal with 1-3kids 6.5 hours a day much less 15 - 25+ per class each day. Throw in staff meetings, PET meetings, curriculum meetings, parent meetings etc. and most good teachers NEED the time off and really use those sick days.

I know a few teachers that have "called" in sick for the last two years before retirement because they have rolled over so many of those "unused sick days". I know of no private sector job where unused sick days are rolled over.


I do understand teaching is a very stressful profession but those two months much help.

[mgifford]

I have a brother-in-law that is a staunch conservative. Obviously from my name you can guess that I’m liberal, actually I very left of liberal. Anyway my brother-in-law does nothing but complain about social programs and how Obama is moving the nation to a socialist state.

I just do not understand the hypocrisy, he is making an excellent living from one of the biggest social programs. I’m forced (have no kids) to pay in excess $6,500 a year out of my property taxes to support the school systems and teachers. He belongs to a Union. He has incredible benefits including fully paid health care and full pension. He gets to do crazy things that we in the private sector would never think about such as carrying over unused vacation days year after year.

It just does not seem right.

Now, yeah. In about three years he'll be shining shoes for a living. BTW, Obama didn't do that for him either, not in six months. Only a FOOL would say ""we're broke, we're going to remedy that by borrowing more money and spending a Trillion on pet projects".

[Celtic Pax]

I know a few teachers that have "called" in sick for the last two years before retirement because they have rolled over so many of those "unused sick days". I know of no private sector job where unused sick days are rolled over.


I do understand teaching is a very stressful profession but those two months much help.

IF most teachers took the 2 months and did nothing I would agree BUT most teacher either work or take courses during those 2 months. I am in private education and continue to teach through the summer (more by choice that required) to ensure income as well as take courses for re-certification.

[Apatriot]

I know a few teachers that have "called" in sick for the last two years before retirement because they have rolled over so many of those "unused sick days". I know of no private sector job where unused sick days are rolled over.

Some do, up to a certain number of hours.

[RWReaganfan]

I know of no private sector job where unused sick days are rolled over.


Do you know of any other profession where you could be exposed to literally thousands of germs and viruses in any given day? Even health care workers don't come in contact with that many runny noses and hacking coughs in a week that teachers do every day.

I worked in the Navy and for AT&T before becoming a teacher. In all of those 18 years, the only time I missed work was with kidney stones.

When I became a teacher, I was out twice within the first six weeks and had walking pneumonia twice in the first two years. Throw in about two or three cases of strep throat every year and you can use up some sick days quickly.

[conservative-gear]

wow - the guy is working for a living not taking handouts - so I guess being left of liberal means that you would be happier if he was home collecting welfare taken from my business profits instead of earning money taken from your property taxes?

[optrader]

You are correct, I have no major problem supporting education. More power to my brother-in-law. But how can you complain about social programs when you earn your living from a social program, even one that was does not work so well.


Hmm... Could there be a possible "cause and effect "here?? :think::think:

[akarra]

I do think this: if he is asked whether he's open to market competition among schools, and he answers "no," then he's definitely a hypocrite.

He can opt out of the Union, but I've had teacher friends who've tried that and it isn't pretty always - btw, empirical data demonstrating to some degree that this country isn't as much corporate controlled as union controlled (http://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/list.php?order=A). I can understand why he wants to play along.

But yeah, generally speaking, I wish more people were in the private sector. Some of the commentators above have noted that education has to be a government responsibility to a degree, and therefore he's entitled to have contrary views to his own situation. I can agree with that, but given the state of the schools now, I don't really want to.