Should ACORN be investigated and stop recieving Federal funding?

[Penrod]

I guess the title speaks for itself. I just cant take it in the census thread anymore so lets just look at ACORN on it own


http://www.google.com/images/icons/sectionized_ui/play_a.gif
(http://www.google.com/url?q=http://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DgaEnDOw3n3w&ei=h55bStqTCJLGML-bhEM&sa=X&oi=video_result&resnum=4&ct=thumbnail&usg=AFQjCNEVK79uf170xbZytVBAMMFKK0nDZw)Corruption is ACORN (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gaEnDOw3n3w)

http://0.gvt0.com/vi/LH-Y4IEmYqw/default.jpg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LH-Y4IEmYqw)
Glenn Beck talks ACORN corruption with Washington Examiner reporter Kevin Mooney (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LH-Y4IEmYqw)

This could go one for hundreds of pages just with videos.

[mozysafe]

no

[Proud Mom and Teacher]

I guess the title speaks for itself. I just cant take it in the census thread anymore so lets just look at ACORN on it own


http://www.google.com/images/icons/sectionized_ui/play_a.gif
(http://www.google.com/url?q=http://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DgaEnDOw3n3w&ei=h55bStqTCJLGML-bhEM&sa=X&oi=video_result&resnum=4&ct=thumbnail&usg=AFQjCNEVK79uf170xbZytVBAMMFKK0nDZw)Corruption is ACORN (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gaEnDOw3n3w)

http://0.gvt0.com/vi/LH-Y4IEmYqw/default.jpg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LH-Y4IEmYqw)
Glenn Beck talks ACORN corruption with Washington Examiner reporter Kevin Mooney (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LH-Y4IEmYqw)

This could go one for hundreds of pages just with videos.
ACORN is being investigated in 14 states. They never should've received funding. Don't see that not happening any time soon though.

[muhadeeb99]

Yes, without a doubt. It may be difficult with all those predetermined connections. Play whack-a-mole with them and they just pop up some where else. Why did they chsnge their name to go international? Cancer spreads like ACORN.

[mozysafe]

http://www.publicintegrity.org/blog/entry/885/?gclid=CN7s1JrJ05sCFRYiagodQylfLA

I dont know anything about this site but its a pretty rational analysis of their situation.

[Penrod]

ACORN is being investigated in 14 states. They never should've received funding. Don't see that not happening any time soon though.
Are these Federal investigations?

[stereo]

Congress is too distracted with the CIA and Cheney. Oh, sorry, the US population is too distracted with the CIA and Cheney.

[ThrowCop]

None of these organizations should be receiving federal monies, IMO.


None of them.

[Penrod]

None of these organizations should be receiving federal monies, IMO.


None of them.
Including schools. Schools belong to the state not the federal government. And we shouldnt be throwing our tax dollars at it. The dept of Education also needs to go along with thousands of other places are tax dollars are unconstitutionally spent.

[ThrowCop]

Including schools. Schools belong to the state not the federal government. And we shouldnt be throwing our tax dollars at it. The dept of Education also needs to go along with thousands of other places are tax dollars are unconstitutionally spent.Agreed. IMO, the President's Cabinet should have less than half the members it currently does overseeing 1/10 of the programs they currently do...

[Penrod]

Agreed. IMO, the President's Cabinet should have less than half the members it currently does overseeing 1/10 of the programs they currently do...
We could stand to take a few Czars off the public take as well

[ThrowCop]

We could stand to take a few Czars off the public take as wellOr just appoint a "Waste Elimination" Czar & give him nothing to do...

:lol:

[mozysafe]

The biggest current wasteful govt. agency is Homeland security.

[muhadeeb99]

Should we have citizen investigators? Let loose the dogs of war.:exclaim:

[BigBear]

I guess the title speaks for itself. I just cant take it in the census thread anymore so lets just look at ACORN on it own
WIthin a minute of the video we have MIchelle Bachman making her false claim that ACORN stands to get 8.1 Billion dollars.
This is the thing with the anti-ACORN crowd - they lie.
If you want to criticize ACORN, or fight against it receiving Fed money - fine. But it seems that the anti-ACORN crowd just isn't honest, or is ignorant, or both.
One of the biggest lies is the use of the word "fraud", claiming that ACORN has engaged in "voter fraud". Apparently the anti-ACORN crowd doesn't understand what constitutes "voter fraud", or they are dishonest. In fact there is no evidence of voter fraud, except for a couple of onesies-twosies things involving ACORN workers personal votes.

[Penrod]

WIthin a minute of the video we have MIchelle Bachman making her false claim that ACORN stands to get 8.1 Billion dollars.
This is the thing with the anti-ACORN crowd - they lie.
If you want to criticize ACORN, or fight against it receiving Fed money - fine. But it seems that the anti-ACORN crowd just isn't honest, or is ignorant, or both.
One of the biggest lies is the use of the word "fraud", claiming that ACORN has engaged in "voter fraud". Apparently the anti-ACORN crowd doesn't understand what constitutes "voter fraud", or they are dishonest. In fact there is no evidence of voter fraud, except for a couple of onesies-twosies things involving ACORN workers personal votes.


ACORN: There's the Fraud (http://www.cfif.org/htdocs/freedomline/current/in_our_opinion/ACORN-Theres-the-Fraud.htm)



With approximately a dozen states now investigating thousands and thousands of questionable -- to put it charitably -- voter registrations collected by the Leftist canvassing group ACORN, mainstream media reports from across the country have documented that voter fraud is real. Indeed, as reported by ABC News -- not to mention countless other news outlets -- ACORN itself “admitted [Wednesday] that it had fired some of its workers for falsifying voter registrations.” What’s more, this was no small isolated problem caused by a few bad apples, as ACORN would like the public to believe. Instead, based on stories emerging from Florida to Ohio to Indiana to Nevada, fraud not only ran rampant nationwide in ACORN’s voter registration drive, but also was so blatant and unbelievable to be ready-made fodder for late-night comics.
For instance, MSNBC reported that ACORN hired a canvasser named Jason Anderson among a group of “59 state prison inmates” to solicit voter registrations in Nevada. If that wasn’t enough of an indictment, ACORN later promoted the convict to be a “supervisory ‘team leader,’” before Anderson turned and blew the whistle about the voter fraud that prevailed in ACORN’s Nevada operation.
Anderson not only “told state investigators that some of his co-workers ‘hired by ACORN were lazy crack-heads who … just wanted the money,’” according to MSNBC, but also that those same “inmate colleagues had registered the Dallas Cowboys to vote in Nevada, along with ‘large numbers’ of other fictitious applications.”

[mozysafe]

ACORN: There's the Fraud (http://www.cfif.org/htdocs/freedomline/current/in_our_opinion/ACORN-Theres-the-Fraud.htm)

http://www.publicintegrity.org/blog/entry/885/?gclid=CN7s1JrJ05sCFRYiagodQylfLA

ACORN was legally obligated to turn in all voter registration forms, even blatantly false ones, to the state of Nevada, and almost all states.

[FidelisAdMortem]

Only nonpartisan groups with zero political affiliation should be able to receive govt funding.

That would limit the corruption.

[Penrod]

http://www.publicintegrity.org/blog/entry/885/?gclid=CN7s1JrJ05sCFRYiagodQylfLA

ACORN was legally obligated to turn in all voter registration forms, even blatantly false ones, to the state of Nevada, and almost all states.
So? The point is they have people out doing this stuff. And how do we know weve caught them all? Its not just a few as some here suggest. I think you should look into how much power this organization really has. Its scary .

[mozysafe]

Only nonpartisan groups with zero political affiliation should be able to receive govt funding.

That would limit the corruption.

Those groups dont exist tho.

[bigtwnvin]

These "investigations" will go nowhere. ACORN will continue to be funded by taxpayers. ACORN is an arm of the liberal-socialist ballot stuffing power conspiracy. Until the tyrants are ousted and moral integrity is restored to government, we're screwed. Get used to it. :rolleyes:

[Penrod]

Those groups dont exist tho.
Well then we stand to save a lot of money.

[mozysafe]

So? The point is they have people out doing this stuff. And how do we know weve caught them all? Its not just a few as some here suggest. I think you should look into how much power this organization really has. Its scary .

They dont have that much power. Just because someone registers doesnt mean they vote. If there is actual voter fraud, and not voter-registration fraud, that is a different more serious issue...

but, for some reason i didnt finish my thought last post, this isnt a federal issue, its a states issue. Something ill admit is that there are unnecessarily complicated rules involving voter registration, and the states need to fix it.

[mozysafe]

Well then we stand to save a lot of money.

true

[FidelisAdMortem]

Those groups dont exist tho.

Well I dont mean to be a wiseguy but maybe instead of the slogan change, real change should be implemented.

[Penrod]

They dont have that much power. Just because someone registers doesnt mean they vote. If there is actual voter fraud, and not voter-registration fraud, that is a different more serious issue...

but, for some reason i didnt finish my thought last post, this isnt a federal issue, its a states issue. Something ill admit is that there are unnecessarily complicated rules involving voter registration, and the states need to fix it.
You need to do some studying then. They have far more than you imagine. The have their tentacles into everything.

[mozysafe]

ACORN is similar to the ACLU or NAACP in terms of power, they are no more crooked than any selfpromoting, lobbying type organization on both sides of the aisle. I dont understand the whole census outrage. Someone has to do it, and any sort of fraud on the census would be so obvious we would all know.

[Penrod]

ACORN is similar to the ACLU or NAACP in terms of power, they are no more crooked than any selfpromoting, lobbying type organization on both sides of the aisle. I dont understand the whole census outrage. Someone has to do it, and any sort of fraud on the census would be so obvious we would all know.
Not even close.

[mozysafe]

Not even close.

Find an independent source on ACORN and ill read it, nothing from them or Glen beck.

[Penrod]

Chew on this for a while And I already gave you one.

SEIU, ACORN, and the White House - THE UNION LABEL (http://theunionlabelblog.com/2009/05/16/seiu-acorn-and-the-white-house/)

[mozysafe]

Chew on this for a while And I already gave you one.

SEIU, ACORN, and the White House - THE UNION LABEL (http://theunionlabelblog.com/2009/05/16/seiu-acorn-and-the-white-house/)

Glenn Beck has really gotten his teeth.......

I said something that wasnt Glenn Beck and that was the first sentence.

When i mean independent i mean like the OMB or umm...even a liberal group who is against ACORN.

[Penrod]

Glenn Beck has really gotten his teeth.......

I said something that wasnt Glenn Beck and that was the first sentence.

When i mean independent i mean like the OMB or umm...even a liberal group who is against ACORN.
Its not from Glen Beck . They simply mentioned him.

[mozysafe]

Its not from Glen Beck . They simply mentioned him.

I know but Glenn Beck is clearly biased from the right. If they are as big as you say, there should be a lot of 3rd party data on them.

[Penrod]

I know but Glenn Beck is clearly biased from the right. If they are as big as you say, there should be a lot of 3rd party data on them. That was all third party data. Hers more I already posted
The Union News.: NPR exposes ACORN-SEIU $$ connection (http://theunionnews.blogspot.com/2008/10/npr-exposes-acorn-seiu-connection.html)


You do have a search engine dont you? Give it a shot,

[mozysafe]

That was all third party data. Hers more I already posted
The Union News.: NPR exposes ACORN-SEIU $$ connection (http://theunionnews.blogspot.com/2008/10/npr-exposes-acorn-seiu-connection.html)


You do have a search engine dont you? Give it a shot,


Thats still a far right website but at least they site NPR, so i guess itll work. I dont know what part of, Registering people to vote, giving assistance to people who dont want to lose their homes, and liberal think tanks is evil per se. The last one is obviously gonna be a point of contention.

BTW as you made the accusation the burden is on you to provide the evidence, which you did, and i thank you.

[BigBear]

ACORN: There's the Fraud (http://www.cfif.org/htdocs/freedomline/current/in_our_opinion/ACORN-Theres-the-Fraud.htm)
Exactly. As the report you cite says, there have been many reports of people working for ACORN attempting to defraud ACORN by filling out bogus voter registration forms in order to meet quotas. There are also reports of individuals filling out joke registrations with the names of football players and cartoon characters. All of these forms ACORN must submit, marked as bogus, to election officials: it's the law. ACORN cannot, by law, discard any filled out voter registration form turned in through its organization.

That whole report contains not a single mention of "voter fraud" accusations against ACORN.
As I first posted - people cry out "voter fraud", but the evidence they have isn't even remotely related to actual voter fraud. The accusers try to conflate the issues, either through ignorance or dishonesty.

[BigBear]

They dont have that much power. Just because someone registers doesnt mean they vote. If there is actual voter fraud, and not voter-registration fraud, that is a different more serious issue...
Thank you - I see you made the point already.
Even this so-called fraud isn't actually fraud. All of these bogus registration were marked as 'questionable' by ACORN when they were submitted. The state election officials then do their own check, and of course toss out these registrations - thus no bogus registration for "Bugs Bunny" or "Troy Aikman" even gets created.

but, for some reason i didnt finish my thought last post, this isnt a federal issue, its a states issue. Something ill admit is that there are unnecessarily complicated rules involving voter registration, and the states need to fix it.Agreed.

[bigtwnvin]

I know but Glenn Beck is clearly biased from the right. If they are as big as you say, there should be a lot of 3rd party data on them.

So if Glenn Beck makes a comment based on factual information he will of course be "clearly biased from the right"?
Whoa Nellie!:eek:

[Proud Mom and Teacher]

Are these Federal investigations?
The FBI opened an investigation last October.

There are 14 states that are conducting their own investigations.
http://www.rottenacorn.com/activityMap.html

[LouC]

No groups such as ACORN and their sub chapters should ever receive one cent of taxpayer confiscated earnings.

Since they have received such funds their books and their sub chapter books should be opened and accessible for official public perusal.

Let the chips fall as they may.

Said books shall remain open until the day a bill is enacted and signed into law and begun making it illegal for them to receive such funds or until the day they voluntarily refuse forever to seek such funding.

[Proud Mom and Teacher]

Thank you - I see you made the point already.
Even this so-called fraud isn't actually fraud. All of these bogus registration were marked as 'questionable' by ACORN when they were submitted. The state election officials then do their own check, and of course toss out these registrations - thus no bogus registration for "Bugs Bunny" or "Troy Aikman" even gets created.
Agreed.

I answered this in the other ACORN thread. But I'll cut and paste here:

Telling people how to vote when you register them isn't fraudulent?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jsT0L...RN%2C+st+louis (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jsT0LdeVomc&eurl=http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/search?q=ACORN%2C+st+louis)

And you're quite funny if you're claiming there was fraud AGAINST ACORN.

ACORN employees were the ones committing the voter registration fraud. That hardly sounds like the company is a victim. :lol:



(From a CNN investigation report, of all people.)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gkUKOSnv2zY

And this, from a worker:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9xjN...eature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9xjNtHo35g&feature=related)

[ThrowCop]

No groups such as ACORN and their sub chapters should ever receive one cent of taxpayer confiscated earnings.

Since they have received such funds their books and their sub chapter books should be opened and accessible for official public perusal.

Let the chips fall as they may.

Said books shall remain open until the day a bill is enacted and signed into law and begun making it illegal for them to receive such funds or until the day they voluntarily refuse forever to seek such funding.You are SO in the tank for ACORN... :rolleyes:




;)

[BigBear]

I answered this in the other ACORN thread. But I'll cut and paste here:

Telling people how to vote when you register them isn't fraudulent?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jsT0L...RN%2C+st+louis (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jsT0LdeVomc&eurl=http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/search?q=ACORN%2C+st+louis)
Here's the thing - you're changing your accusations. First it was "voter fraud", now you're claiming that encouraging people how to vote constitutes fraud. YOu can't support your original accusation. Admit that first, then we can discuss your next issue.

And you're quite funny if you're claiming there was fraud AGAINST ACORN.
ACORN employees were the ones committing the voter registration fraud. That hardly sounds like the company is a victim. :lol:It was fraud AGAINST ACORN because their contractors filled out bogus forms in order to meet quotas in order to get paid. ACORN has changed their system of payments to avoid this incentive to fraud.

(From a CNN investigation report, of all people.)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gkUKOSnv2zY


I've seen that video before. CNN doesn't do a very good job with their report, but if you'll notice in the video it simply restates what I and others have already told you: ACORN MUST BY LAW turn in ALL registrations which come to it - even the ones documented here that it knows are bogus. ACORN cannot reject voter registration forms. None of those registrations were turned in as "OK", and none of them resulted in even a bogus voter registration - they were rejected by the state. Please acknowledge that you understand this point.

[BigBear]

So if Glenn Beck makes a comment based on factual information he will of course be "clearly biased from the right"?
That's a big "if". I've watched Glenn Beck on ACORN, and he deals almost exclusively in innuendo. He asks "questions" and let's them stand as unfounded allegations for example.
Seems to work quite well with his gullible audience, as evidence by the posts of some here.

[LouC]

I answered this in the other ACORN thread. But I'll cut and paste here:

Cool it makes it far easier to respond since I have once already. :lol:

Telling people how to vote when you register them isn't fraudulent?

As long as it doesn't violate electioneering statues then no it likely isn't.

It is no different than a politician on a commercial or at a campaign rally directing people to "vote for me".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jsT0LdeVomc&eurl=http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/search?q=ACORN%2C+st+louis

And you're quite funny if you're claiming there was fraud AGAINST ACORN.

Well yes it is possible.

Just like a bank employee that embezzles money.

Any fraudulent activity that the ACORN employee engages in that they were not instructed to do, or trained to do is also fraud against their employer.

ACORN employees were the ones committing the voter registration fraud. That hardly sounds like the company is a victim. :lol:

Unless the fraud was perpetrated under direction of ACORN or caused by ACORN induced duress then indeed ACORN is a victim.

(From a CNN investigation report, of all people.)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gkUKOSnv2zY

And this, from a worker:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9xjNtHo35g&feature=related


YouTube links without adequate or any synopsis are not proof of anything, well, except maybe desperation

[LouC]

That's a big "if". I've watched Glenn Beck on ACORN, and he deals almost exclusively in innuendo. He asks "questions" and let's them stand as unfounded allegations for example.
Seems to work quite well with his gullible audience, as evidence by the posts of some here.

He should not, NOT, be anyone's sole source on ACORN.

Unless you are quite content to let someone else do your critical thinking and conclusion making for you.

If so ignore the Lou.

[Lord of Mirrors]

It's no longer ACORN. They did a slick little name change. It's now COI, Community Organizers International.

[LouC]

You are SO in the tank for ACORN... :rolleyes:




;)

Yes people are convinced I am an ACORN employee.

I would love to know where my checks are?

And do I get benefits?

Something ain't right... :think:

[Traveller]

It's no longer ACORN. They did a slick little name change. It's now COI, Community Organizers International.

Typical leftist switcheroo. When the heat is on, change the vernacular.
Pro abortion becomes Pro choice
Liberal becomes progressive
ACORN becomes COI
Nothing new, we just have to let everyone possible know about it.

[Proud Mom and Teacher]

Here's the thing - you're changing your accusations. First it was "voter fraud", now you're claiming that encouraging people how to vote constitutes fraud. YOu can't support your original accusation. Admit that first, then we can discuss your next issue.

It was fraud AGAINST ACORN because their contractors filled out bogus forms in order to meet quotas in order to get paid. ACORN has changed their system of payments to avoid this incentive to fraud.


I've seen that video before. CNN doesn't do a very good job with their report, but if you'll notice in the video it simply restates what I and others have already told you: ACORN MUST BY LAW turn in ALL registrations which come to it - even the ones documented here that it knows are bogus. ACORN cannot reject voter registration forms. None of those registrations were turned in as "OK", and none of them resulted in even a bogus voter registration - they were rejected by the state. Please acknowledge that you understand this point.

You're the one who brought up, in the other thread, that voter registration fraud really isn't voter fraud. I'm not going to dig up circumstances that might be voter fraud vs. voter registration fraud. Quite honestly, I find them both to be fraud, but YOU asked for an example, so I provided it for you.

Second point, many of the workers have testified and/or discussed in interviews that the management at ACORN instructed them to engage in the illegal actions that they subsequently engaged in. Are they lying?

AND, this is the funny part, you act as if they turned in the 10s of 1000s of bogus registration card as one that were clearly marked as "questionable" voter registration forms, just as they were supposed to do. ARE YOU KIDDING YOURSELF OR TRYING TO CONVINCE SOMEONE ELSE of this blatant lie?

BS!!!!!!!!

[LouC]

It's no longer ACORN. They did a slick little name change. It's now COI, Community Organizers International.

Yes and Prince was and still is Prince.

Kids at daycare will come to know COI and only COI, I might go to my grave still calling them ACORN, or at the most ACORN-COI.

I would prefer going to my grave not calling them anything cause they are no more.

[Proud Mom and Teacher]

Cool it makes it far easier to respond since I have once already. :lol:



<snip>

I'm sorry for you that you did. I thought they made you look foolish the first time I read them. You'll notice I didn't even respond. I was trying to be nice a give you a pass. :lol:

[LouC]

I'm sorry for you that you did. I thought they made you look foolish the first time I read them. You'll notice I didn't even respond. I was trying to be nice a give you a pass. :lol:

No reason for my responses to do that.

Posting video links without backing is another thing.

[BigBear]

He should not, NOT, be anyone's sole source on ACORN.

Unless you are quite content to let someone else do your critical thinking and conclusion making for you.

If so ignore the Lou.
I'm agreeing with you 100%.

Reading some of the anti-ACORN posts over time, it seems like the thinking there is that documented evidence is for people who are too lazy to make things up.