Find Speed Traps in your area

[ArizonaLibertarian]

link here....

http://www.speedtrap.org/speed-traps/find/


iPhone has speed trap app that beeps when approaching the redlight cameras also.

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/local/Devices-that-warn-drivers-of-speed_-red-light-cameras-draw-police-ire-7930619-50074717.html

[LouC]

link here....

http://www.speedtrap.org/speed-traps/find/


iPhone has speed trap app that beeps when approaching the redlight cameras also.

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/local/Devices-that-warn-drivers-of-speed_-red-light-cameras-draw-police-ire-7930619-50074717.html

What asinine crap.

Just what a driver needs, more reason to ignore the rules of the road and more idiotic BS to distract them while they are doing it. :rolleyes:

Drive alertly, safely, legally, and quit putting me and others at greater risk on the road you selfish bastards that "try to beat the man".

[ArizonaLibertarian]

Speed traps are used by municipalities to generate revenue to run the government. "Safety" is given as the excuse for running a speed trap, but the real reason boils down to money.

The police department wants more money for equipment and salaries.
The City wants more money to avoid raising taxes.

There is one thing you should know about the red light cameras.

Red light cameras are 'calibrated low' to increase revenue for the states and cities......surrounding yellow to red light intervals may be 5.5 seconds.......but the redlight camera is calibrated low sometimes down to 4.5 seconds to trap drivers.

I'm all for technology that helps honest people beat a corrupt system which is more about raising revenue than "safety".

[redfish64]

As long as Obama is in office we will need to find "tax traps" not speed traps.:eek:

[LouC]

Speed traps are used by municipalities to generate revenue to run the government. "Safety" is given as the excuse for running a speed trap, but the real reason boils down to money.

The police department wants more money for equipment and salaries.
The City wants more money to avoid raising taxes.

There is one thing you should know about the red light cameras.

Red light cameras are 'calibrated low' to increase revenue for the states and cities......surrounding yellow to red light intervals may be 5.5 seconds.......but the redlight camera is calibrated low sometimes down to 4.5 seconds to trap drivers.

I'm all for technology that helps honest people beat a corrupt system which is more about raising revenue than "safety".

Honest people don't try to run yellow lights in order to beat having to sit at OMG a red light.

Yes every place the red light cameras are put up people whine "they are just for revenue" or "they timed them to generate more money".

So?

How many people actually timed the lights before the cameras?

How do they know?

Hell yes the real reason is money.

People don't know how much running red lights costs this nation in monetary amounts due to idiot drivers that aren't aware of red lights or are aware and try to beat them not to mention all the life and limb costs from auto accidents?

If they also gain revenue because of people that just refuse to drive safely I don't care.

If .5 of a second makes that much of a difference then people should adjust their speed accordingly.

If people want to defund the corrupt system, get rid of your car and walk, if you feel that strongly about it.

In my opinion driving is a privilege, one that requires all drivers to be following the rules, not just some, while others try to "beat the man".

A privilege, not a God given right.

[Socrates]

What asinine crap.

Just what a driver needs, more reason to ignore the rules of the road and more idiotic BS to distract them while they are doing it. :rolleyes:

Drive alertly, safely, legally, and quit putting me and others at greater risk on the road you selfish bastards that "try to beat the man".

I can understand being against speedtrap cameras because speed limits are largely arbitrary. Going, say, 38mph in a 30mph zone isn't exactly a hazard.

Red light cameras seem like a no brainer though. They can't ticket you unless you are doing something objectively hazardous. Are there people who feel the need to run red lights on a regular basis?

I got a red light camera ticket once. They actually sent me a link to a Quicktime video of my infraction. I had just blown right through the light. Not sure what distracted me but I certainly couldn't complain about getting the ticket.

[ChicoLibertarian]

I can understand being against speedtrap cameras because speed limits are largely arbitrary. Going, say, 38mph in a 30mph zone isn't exactly a hazard.

Red light cameras seem like a no brainer though. They can't ticket you unless you are doing something objectively hazardous. Are there people who feel the need to run red lights on a regular basis?

I agree with you on the speeding issue. I once got a ticket for 62 in a 55 and it really, really ****ed me off. If it's a 55+ zone, I almost always drive 5-7 mph over the speed limit.

Blowing through a red light? I agree, ticket them. However, the one that seems to be rising in popularity is the camera on the right turn and the camera tickets you if you do not come to a complete stop. That is BS, in my opinion.

[ddye]

I can understand being against speedtrap cameras because speed limits are largely arbitrary. Going, say, 38mph in a 30mph zone isn't exactly a hazard.

Red light cameras seem like a no brainer though. They can't ticket you unless you are doing something objectively hazardous. Are there people who feel the need to run red lights on a regular basis?

I got a red light camera ticket once. They actually sent me a link to a Quicktime video of my infraction. I had just blown right through the light. Not sure what distracted me but I certainly couldn't complain about getting the ticket.
The thing is that a lot of localities shorten the yellow light so more people end up running it, bringing in more revenue by promoting something that is less safe.

Doug

[sironin]

I agree with you on the speeding issue. I once got a ticket for 62 in a 55 and it really, really ****ed me off. If it's a 55+ zone, I almost always drive 5-7 mph over the speed limit.

Blowing through a red light? I agree, ticket them. However, the one that seems to be rising in popularity is the camera on the right turn and the camera tickets you if you do not come to a complete stop. That is BS, in my opinion.

In my state at least, red lights are treated as stop signs with respect to right hand turns. One has to come to a complete stop at the stop sign before moving past the stop sign unless the intersection has a specifically posted exception.

[Socrates]

The thing is that a lot of localities shorten the yellow light so more people end up running it, bringing in more revenue by promoting something that is less safe.

Doug

You're not supposed to enter an intersection when the light is yellow anyway.

[LouC]

I can understand being against speedtrap cameras because speed limits are largely arbitrary. Going, say, 38mph in a 30mph zone isn't exactly a hazard...

Your decision to drive 38 in a 30 may be an arbitrary decision but the posted speed limit is not.

ar·bi·trar·y

ADJECTIVE:

1. Determined by chance, whim, or impulse, and not by necessity, reason, or principle: stopped at the first motel we passed, an arbitrary choice.

2. Based on or subject to individual judgment or preference: The diet imposes overall calorie limits, but daily menus are arbitrary.

3. Established by a court or judge rather than by a specific law or statute: an arbitrary penalty.

4. Not limited by law; despotic: the arbitrary rule of a dictator.

[ChicoLibertarian]

In my state at least, red lights are treated as stop signs with respect to right hand turns. One has to come to a complete stop at the stop sign before moving past the stop sign unless the intersection has a specifically posted exception.

Certianly the case in California as well, however, how many times have you come to a stop signal with a right turn lane. The "though" signal is red and there is no right turn arrow, but the traffic to your right is making a left turn, thus ensuring that no traffic could be entering the intersection from your left. In this situation, I almost never come to a complete stop...I brake to 1 or 2 mph, and then proceed with my right turn.

Should I get a ticket? Clearly I took nobody's right of way, nor did I endanger the non-existent moving traffic from my left. By the book? Yes, I broke the law, however I've done the same manuever with a cop behind me and I have not received a ticket. The camera on the other hand will ticket you and I think it's BS. And it's not just me, but many, many people are pushing back against this type of revenue generation.

[LouC]

The thing is that a lot of localities shorten the yellow light so more people end up running it, bringing in more revenue by promoting something that is less safe.

Doug

I keep hearing that but really have not seen it in evidence, do you have any?

[jimjames418]

However, the one that seems to be rising in popularity is the camera on the right turn and the camera tickets you if you do not come to a complete stop. That is BS, in my opinion.
That is called a "Michigan stop". The law says "stop, check traffic, then turn right if no on coming traffic". It doesn't say slow down, it says stop.

BTW, most people, even when they stop could receive a ticket. You must come to a complete stop BEFORE the stop sign, not the cross road. ;)

[McCoyFan]

Yes every place the red light cameras are put up people whine "they are just for revenue" or "they timed them to generate more money".



camera or no camera,
if they dont run the red light, they dont have to pay the money
if paying the money is their main concern

[Dim Reefer]

What asinine crap.

Just what a driver needs, more reason to ignore the rules of the road and more idiotic BS to distract them while they are doing it. :rolleyes:

Drive alertly, safely, legally, and quit putting me and others at greater risk on the road you selfish bastards that "try to beat the man".

The majority of speeding tickets are actually illegal. Pace tickets are about the biggest scam out there.

Here is a video on it.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fujWx7jFDWs

[Socrates]

Your decision to drive 38 in a 30 may be an arbitrary decision but the posted speed limit is not.
Both are arbitrary according to the definitions you posted.

[Dim Reefer]

As long as Obama is in office we will need to find "tax traps" not speed traps.:eek:

hahaha

[ChicoLibertarian]

That is called a "Michigan stop". The law says "stop, check traffic, then turn right if no on coming traffic". It doesn't say slow down, it says stop.

And in my later post I indicated that I was fully aware of the meaning of the red light. The way I see it, officers see the totality of the situation, whereas the cameras only looks to see that your forward motion stops completely.

[freemind]

Regarding red-light cameras, some studies have shown that they increase accidents.

http://www.motorists.org/blog/red-light-cameras-increase-accidents-5-studies-that-prove-it/

[Libstomper]

I wonder if that app is legal in VA.

[freemind]

I keep hearing that but really have not seen it in evidence, do you have any?

http://www.motorists.org/blog/6-cities-that-were-caught-shortening-yellow-light-times-for-profit/

[snagswolf]

I have my own method for locating speed traps.

It's very effective.

[Dim Reefer]

http://www.trapster.com is a free service..

[uncledoom]

If a speed limit is posted and you are not going said speed, how is that a trap?

Slowing down and continuing at a stop sign is a "yield"....an that's a totally different sign.

[snagswolf]

If a speed limit is posted and you are not going said speed, how is that a trap?

Slowing down and continuing at a stop sign is a "yield"....an that's a totally different sign.
You should change your username to 'grandpadoom'.

[pattyk]

my state voted recently for NO cameras allowed.

reason: if the infraction hadn't been directly observed by an officer, nothing happened.

[LouC]

http://www.motorists.org/blog/6-cities-that-were-caught-shortening-yellow-light-times-for-profit/

Thanks for that worthless attempt to evidence Doug's contention.

The thing is that a lot of localities shorten the yellow light so more people end up running it, bringing in more revenue by promoting something that is less safe.

Doug

It failed miserably when I dug a little deeper and read the full stories of what that website claimed were "6 Cities That Were Caught Shortening Yellow Light Times For Profit".

City 1) Engineering mix up involving a turn signal at the intersection in question. The first story did not reveal any overt or covert attempt to shorten yellow for revenue.

City 2) Existing yellows were already short where cameras were installed.

City 3) Existing yellows were already short where cameras were installed.

City 4) Issue of short yellows known and to be addressed before cameras were installed.

City 5) No cameras at all involved with this short yellow story.

City 6) Existing yellows were already short where cameras were installed.

No city was exposed for intentionally reducing yellow light timing to increase revenue.

One of the cities above removed some cameras because they worked so well that it cost more to have them at the intersection than they were generating in revenue.

One of these evil cities had only one camera.

[RogerDodger]

The small Georgia town of Ludowici used to have such a bad reputation as a speed trap that the governor of the state put up billboards outside of town warning motorists they were entering a speed trap. Here's two stories I found about it:

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,909123,00.html?iid=chix-sphere

http://www.onlineathens.com/stories/030704/fea_20040307068.shtml

The Time article is rather old, but I can assure you things haven't changed that much. You've got to love small Southern towns.

[gwhughes]

I keep hearing that but really have not seen it in evidence, do you have any?

You've never seen a "quick yellow" I have. I don't have proof, but I have encountered them. For what it's worth.

[Pauper66]

I found a speed trap here a few weeks ago.

It cost me $65. 41 in a 35.

[LouC]

You've never seen a "quick yellow" I have. I don't have proof, but I have encountered them. For what it's worth.

What on earth makes you think I have never seen a quick yellow?

[Pauper66]

Speed traps are used by municipalities to generate revenue to run the government. "Safety" is given as the excuse for running a speed trap, but the real reason boils down to money.

The police department wants more money for equipment and salaries.
The City wants more money to avoid raising taxes.

Re: my post in this thread-what they do here:

The cops usually park around a curve or just over a crest, or hid their cars behind shrubs, trees, etc. One cop will on the side of the road with a radar gun, and wave speeders over where they have two -three cops issuing citations.

I was in and out in under 10 minutes with a $65 ticket. They consistentlt kept three cars pulled over. As soon as one pulls out, they have another violator tagged and bagged.

So...assuming ten minutes per violator, this method should result in 18 tickets/hour.

18*65=$1170.00 * 4 hours= $4680/day * 3 days week= $14,040/week *52= 730,080/year.

That's one stop in one county. Set up two stops in each of the 4 counties here, and that's over $5.8 million/year coming in.

And that's at the base of $65/ticket. 10 over will get you $172. Add to that seat belt or no insurance, bad registration tickets....and you got yourself a real money maker.

[Pauper66]

What exactly is a "quickie yellow" and why would it matter? As long as you break the plane of the intersection before the light is red, you have the right to clear the intersection without a violation.

[CaptainPike]

You're not supposed to enter an intersection when the light is yellow anyway.

The book presented to me by the state of Kansas plainly says that you should enter the intersection when you know that you can't safely stop. So which is it? Oh nevermind, just pay the ticket. It's easier.

[LouC]

What exactly is a "quickie yellow" and why would it matter? As long as you break the plane of the intersection before the light is red, you have the right to clear the intersection without a violation.

"quickie yellows" as you call them, are the yellow caution lights on a tri-color traffic signal that are timed to last for shorter intervals than traffic engineering studies recommend for an intersection.

[stodr]

Thanks for that worthless attempt to evidence Doug's contention.



It failed miserably when I dug a little deeper and read the full stories of what that website claimed were "6 Cities That Were Caught Shortening Yellow Light Times For Profit".

City 1) Engineering mix up involving a turn signal at the intersection in question. The first story did not reveal any overt or covert attempt to shorten yellow for revenue.

City 2) Existing yellows were already short where cameras were installed.

City 3) Existing yellows were already short where cameras were installed.

City 4) Issue of short yellows known and to be addressed before cameras were installed.

City 5) No cameras at all involved with this short yellow story.

City 6) Existing yellows were already short where cameras were installed.

No city was exposed for intentionally reducing yellow light timing to increase revenue.

One of the cities above removed some cameras because they worked so well that it cost more to have them at the intersection than they were generating in revenue.

One of these evil cities had only one camera.

In other cities, the percentages are even worse. In Charlotte, North Carolina, WBTV found their safety conscious officials failed to install cameras at 23 of the highest-crash intersections. And in San Diego, the Red Light Camera Defense Team, a consortium of pro bono lawyers representing motorists against the city found that 12 of the 19 red-light camera intersections had three-second yellow intervals, and that Lockheed Martin IMS--our old friends from D.C.--had sought out intersections with high traffic volume, short yellow cycles, and downhill approaches--the kinds of intersections that citation-happy police officers used to call "cherry ponds" or "duck patches." What the lawyers didn't find was any evidence supporting officials' claims that their program, like D.C.'s and Charlotte's before it, was "about safety." Not a single one of the city's 19 cameras was operating at one of its highest-accident sites.

http://www.motorists.org/photoenforce/home/inside-red-light-cameras/

[gwhughes]

What on earth makes you think I have never seen a quick yellow?

:)) sorry but your response made me think of prostate trouble.


I guess I was just making the point that IF a quick yellow was monitored by a camera, which isn't totally inconceivable, it would seem an unethical practice.

[LouC]

http://www.motorists.org/photoenforce/home/inside-red-light-cameras/

Yes that is the website that lied about the "6 Cities That Were Caught Shortening Yellow Light Times For Profit"

I am aware of their stance on red light cameras.

[LouC]

:)) sorry but your response made me think of prostate trouble.

:eek:

I guess I was just making the point that IF a quick yellow was monitored by a camera, which isn't totally inconceivable, it would seem an unethical practice.

It might be.

It might also be considered so if there is no camera but there is an officer hidden at the intersection.

People can take matters into their own hands and petition for redress (is that the term) if they find malfunctioning or improperly timed lights.

[gdoane]

My problem with cameras is they reduce the presence of officers and do not address the REASON for the violation.

Why is the driver violating the law? Is he driving drunk? Is he driving distracted because he's texting on his cell phone? Cameras don't answer these questions and do nothing to mitigate the danger with a ticket arriving in the mail weeks later.

Do you know the biggest giveaway for drunk drivers? It's not their crummy driving, it's that they forget to turn on their headlights. Their pupils, dilated by the effects of alcohol, see things as brighter than they really are. This is why bars are typically lit dimly. The drunk, thinking that twilight is plenty of light, doesn't turn on his headlights and what's a camera going to do about that?

NOTHING.

Cameras don't take dangerous drivers off the roads. What they do is take the cops off the roads who have the intelligence and judgment to assess real threats and deal with them real-time. Cameras leave threats on the road and send the postman after them later, which is a ridiculous way to handle a real threat to public safety.

Shooting the bad guy only stops the crime if you're using a Smith and Wesson, not a Kodak.

[CaptainPike]

My problem with cameras is they reduce the presence of officers and do not address the REASON for the violation.

Why is the driver violating the law? Is he driving drunk? Is he driving distracted because he's texting on his cell phone? Cameras don't answer these questions and do nothing to mitigate the danger with a ticket arriving in the mail weeks later.

Do you know the biggest giveaway for drunk drivers? It's not their crummy driving, it's that they forget to turn on their headlights. Their pupils, dilated by the effects of alcohol, see things as brighter than they really are. This is why bars are typically lit dimly. The drunk, thinking that twilight is plenty of light, doesn't turn on his headlights and what's a camera going to do about that?

NOTHING.

Cameras don't take dangerous drivers off the roads. What they do is take the cops off the roads who have the intelligence and judgment to assess real threats and deal with them real-time. Cameras leave threats on the road and send the postman after them later, which is a ridiculous way to handle a real threat to public safety.

Shooting the bad guy only stops the crime if you're using a Smith and Wesson, not a Kodak.

Cameras make money for local governments, and that's all that matters.

You'll pay your ticket and like it!

[gwhughes]

I don't know if it's urban legend or true, but here goes.

Guy got a ticket in the mail for $150 for running a red light. Enclosed was a picture of infraction, guy's car, clear view of license plate. Guy, unwilling to accept this form of fine, spread out $150 on his bed, took a picture and sent it to the police. They sent back a picture of handcuffs. He paid the fine. :)

[gdoane]

Cameras make money for local governments, and that's all that matters.

You'll pay your ticket and like it!

Not likely. I've never gotten such a ticket, but of those who have the compliance rate is pathetic in Arizona.

http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2009/01/21/20090121speedcams.html

Fewer than 30% of speed camera tickets from Arizona DPS are paid. Most violations wind up in the trash. They hold no legal weight anyway until there's a summons served.

[uncledoom]

You should change your username to 'grandpadoom'.

Just stating the facts. I'm as much a lead foot as anyone else...but you must pick and choose your spots.

It's funny to imagine all these freaked out drivers carefully navigating around these traps...but when they get there...:eek:....no cops to be seen.

[countmein]

You know, as a mother of a 15 year old learning to drive, reading what some of you have written scares the crap out of me. I am pretty confident in her driving. I am more afraid of her being on the road with some of you.

You don't want to earn a ticket? Obey the law. See how simple that was.

[sgdp]

I almost got plowed over by a CTA bus today.

I was turning left on green. They had the red, but apparently after every stop they just assume they can go through a red light.

[sgdp]

By the way, a friend of mine in England said a group of kids got in huge trouble protesting the red light cameras in their own little way.

They switched the license plates from police officers' cars, put them on their own car, and then ran multiple red lights. :)) All the tickets sent to the cops!

[jimjames418]

Back in the early 1960's there was a red light in Americus, Ga that was ran by every car coming through. Those with out of state tags received tickets.

The red light was located in a big oak tree and no way in hell could anyone on the hi-way see it.

When I-75 was first opened through Atlanta, GA I received a ticket for speeding in a school zone while on I-75. It seems that the hi-way cut through a school ground and they failed to rezone the area. At the time the speed limit was 75 mph. That one I fought and won.

[gdoane]

You know, as a mother of a 15 year old learning to drive, reading what some of you have written scares the crap out of me. I am pretty confident in her driving. I am more afraid of her being on the road with some of you.

You don't want to earn a ticket? Obey the law. See how simple that was.

I'm an electronics technician with over 25 years of professional experience repairing broken gadgets. The only reason I have total and complete job security is because of the plain and simple fact that electronics ARE NOT INFALLIBLE.

There are two kinds of electronics. Failed electronics, and electronics which WILL fail.

According to Redflex Systems, the Australian company which maintains and operates the camera systems on Arizona freeways, nearly 3 out of 4 images are thrown out because of errors.

Errors like dirty windshields making it impossible to identify the driver. Sun glare. No vehicle in the shot. Illegible license plates.

Add to that the compliance rate of only 1/3 of fine notices sent out to the mere 1/4 of the pictures good enough to maybe stand up in court and fewer than one in ten photo citations are even effective. It's got more than a 90% failure rate overall.

They say the camera doesn't lie. Well, they don't work either and I've seen several myself flash at NOTHING. No vehicle within a half-mile and the cameras just go off.

You don't have to speed or break any law to get caught by these crummy Australian cameras. Their third-world technology is so bad that they're catching ghost drivers.

[Paul31]

I got stopped a couple weeks ago by a female deputy sheriff. She said that I ran a red light. I asked her "Well isn't that for the Circuit Court Judge to decide?" I received a warning. :) I think that she figured out that I was planning on fighting the ticket, and she didn't want to go to court. :)

[Pauper66]

Over here the cops get paid EXTRA for going to court.

[Samm]

What exactly is a "quickie yellow" and why would it matter? As long as you break the plane of the intersection before the light is red, you have the right to clear the intersection without a violation.

Yellow lights are supposed to stay on long enough so that you can come to a safe stop from the prevailing speed if it comes on as you are approaching the intersection. They are timed so that if you are inside the zone (known as the zone of decision) in which a safe controlled stop can be accomplished, that you will be across the stop line (into the intersection) prior to the red light coming on and thus not in violation. A "short" light will turn red when you are still outside the intersection, but unable to stop, thus forcing you to "run" the red light.

[sgdp]

Yellow lights are supposed to stay on long enough so that you can come to a safe stop from the prevailing speed if it comes on as you are approaching the intersection. They are timed so that if you are inside the zone (known as the zone of decision) in which a safe controlled stop can be accomplished, that you will be across the stop line (into the intersection) prior to the red light coming on and thus not in violation. A "short" light will turn red when you are still outside the intersection, but unable to stop, thus forcing you to "run" the red light.

Was always taught, "If you have to slam on your brakes, you should have gone. If you have to speed up, you should have stopped."

But...

No rules apply in major cities. You just try to not get killed.

[Talk2Bill]

i love it, you're the one speeding, and you are by far more likely to be hurt or killed in a car crash than a violent crime. the cop is there to legally enforce a clearly posted speed limit there for your own safety. yet it is a speed trap?

(now there are some true speed traps. but those are rare.)

[Samm]

Was always taught, "If you have to slam on your brakes, you should have gone. If you have to speed up, you should have stopped."

But...

No rules apply in major cities. You just try to not get killed.

That's why it is called the "zone of decision." Each driver and car is different. It is the responsibility of the each driver to decide whether they can safely stop on yellow or if it is safer to go on into and through the intersection. In addition to the yellow light being timed appropriately for the speed of the road, there is supposed to be a delay (usually 1-3 seconds) between the red light in one direction and the green light in the cross direction. This gives a bit of buffer to the driver who "decides" incorrectly about going through the yellow rather than stopping.

[sgdp]

That's why it is called the "zone of decision." Each driver and car is different. It is the responsibility of the each driver to decide whether they can safely stop on yellow or if it is safer to go on into and through the intersection. In addition to the yellow light being timed appropriately for the speed of the road, there is supposed to be a delay (usually 1-3 seconds) between the red light in one direction and the green light in the cross direction. This gives a bit of buffer to the driver who "decides" incorrectly about going through the yellow rather than stopping.

Yes. And to adjust for weather conditions. I totally blew a red light with a cop behind me, because I knew with the ice I couldn't safely stop. Cop knew it, too, I guess, because he didn't pull me over.

[Samm]

Yes. And to adjust for weather conditions. I totally blew a red light with a cop behind me, because I knew with the ice I couldn't safely stop. Cop knew it, too, I guess, because he didn't pull me over.

The adjustment for weather (and road) conditions is also your responsibility... it's part of the "decision" process. You are lucky you did not get a ticket for violating basic speed and running the red light.

[Mimiheart]

I was driving on the freeway with a speed limit of 65 last week. Every time there was a "photo enforcement zone" everyone slammed on their brakes so they (we) were all going between 45-50. Yeah, THAT'S safe. Also, there's no posted speed limit anywhere near where the photo enforcement zone sign is, so people have to guess if they're going the right speed if they aren't familiar with the freeway.

[FidelisAdMortem]

Personally I dont know of one police officer who is in favor of redlight cameras or speed photo enforcement areas.

Although here in the NYPD we are for law enforcement, we're for doing it ourselves.

[NascarGirl2448]

You know, as a mother of a 15 year old learning to drive, reading what some of you have written scares the crap out of me. I am pretty confident in her driving. I am more afraid of her being on the road with some of you.

You don't want to earn a ticket? Obey the law. See how simple that was.

Problem is that these stupid cameras don't realize why a person may be running a red light. I've heard of people getting tickets because of being in funeral processions (escorted by police officers) and going through intersections while the light was indeed red, which is legal in such situations. I've done it myself, but luckily Richmond doesn't have those stupid cameras on Monument Avenue. At my grandparents' funerals, we had a police escort. Same at my great-aunt's funeral, as well as my uncle's funeral. We went through several red lights with the police officer blocking the intersection from on-coming traffic.

[BillBrown]

In my state at least, red lights are treated as stop signs with respect to right hand turns. One has to come to a complete stop at the stop sign before moving past the stop sign unless the intersection has a specifically posted exception.

I think every state calls for a complete stop before turning right on a red.

It does in Texas.

The red light camera requires a 3 second stop. It's a contradiction with Texas law.

[BillBrown]

What asinine crap.

Just what a driver needs, more reason to ignore the rules of the road and more idiotic BS to distract them while they are doing it. :rolleyes:

Drive alertly, safely, legally, and quit putting me and others at greater risk on the road you selfish bastards that "try to beat the man".

I would think you would be in favor of the list.
"Well patrolled" routes should be safer- right?

A person might want to choose one of these "safe" routes.

[LouC]

Both are arbitrary according to the definitions you posted.

How do you figure that?

[LouC]

I would think you would be in favor of the list.
"Well patrolled" routes should be safer- right?

A person might want to choose one of these "safe" routes.

The list at the OP's first link?

The one where someone in Illinois posted that last weekend they saw a Police SUV parked hidden behind some bushes on so & so road at such & such time?

That list?

:))

[BillBrown]

The list at the OP's first link?

The one where someone in Illinois posted that last weekend they saw a Police SUV parked hidden behind some bushes on so & so road at such & such time?

That list?

:))

I didn't see that on the list, but I have no problem with publishing that.

Prudent people might want to take that road since it so well patrolled.

What's the worst thing that can happen as a result of that being published?
It will cause people to slow down on that stretch of road.
Why would you object to that?

[LouC]

I didn't see that on the list, but I have no problem with publishing that.

Prudent people might want to take that road since it so well patrolled.

I don't mind people posting that information either.

It does not in any way shape or form constitute one iota of evidence that that location of road is well patrolled.

That is just the silliest notion. :))

Prudent people would not waste their time going through that list in some vain attempt to locate alleged "well patrolled" roads. :))

Oh that is too funny... :))

[BillBrown]

I don't mind people posting that information either.

It does not in any way shape or form constitute one iota of evidence that that location of road is well patrolled.

That is just the silliest notion. :))

Prudent people would not waste their time going through that list in some vain attempt to locate alleged "well patrolled" roads. :))

Oh that is too funny... :))



I'll ask you again.

What is the worst that can happen as a result of that list being published?

What might it do, other that causing people to slow down while driving on the indicated routes?

Why would you object to that?

[jimjames418]

I'll ask you again.

What is the worst that can happen as a result of that list being published?

What might it do, other that causing people to slow down while driving on the indicated routes?

Why would you object to that?
The best place to get a ticket in my area is the 27 miles of I-94 between the state line and Benton Harbor. The state police have 16 vehicles in that stretch of roadway, and 8 of them are on the road all the time.

[sgdp]

The adjustment for weather (and road) conditions is also your responsibility... it's part of the "decision" process. You are lucky you did not get a ticket for violating basic speed and running the red light.

Of course it's my responsibility. Everyone knows that. That's why I was the only one driving sensibly on 94 while the entire road was torn up and the rain was really heavy. :rolleyes:

Sometimes....Only so much you can do. Speed will definitely make it harder to stop, but this intersection is coming down from a hill. I tapped on the brakes and just knew it would end up REALLY badly.

[sgdp]

BTW, my absolute pet peeve is people riding my tail while I slow down for construction zones. Again, I'm the only one that seems to do that, and if I see a worker, I slow down whether there's a warning sign or not.

"A motorist drove into a construction zone on the Bishop Ford Freeway early Friday, striking a worker and pinning him against another vehicle."

^^THAT is why. :mad:

[uncledoom]

I'll ask you again.

What is the worst that can happen as a result of that list being published?

What might it do, other that causing people to slow down while driving on the indicated routes?

Why would you object to that?

It won't harm anything...but it is silly....somewhat paranoid as well. I guess if people are driving into areas they are not familiar with, they can alway have somewhere to reference where they should or shouldn't go over the speed limit.....doesn't that sound kinda silly.

[neoINDIE]

Speed traps are used by municipalities to generate revenue to run the government. "Safety" is given as the excuse for running a speed trap, but the real reason boils down to money.

The police department wants more money for equipment and salaries.
The City wants more money to avoid raising taxes.

There is one thing you should know about the red light cameras.

Red light cameras are 'calibrated low' to increase revenue for the states and cities......surrounding yellow to red light intervals may be 5.5 seconds.......but the redlight camera is calibrated low sometimes down to 4.5 seconds to trap drivers.

I'm all for technology that helps honest people beat a corrupt system which is more about raising revenue than "safety".

My department doesn't get **** for any tickets we write.

FYI.

[neoINDIE]

Problem is that these stupid cameras don't realize why a person may be running a red light. I've heard of people getting tickets because of being in funeral processions (escorted by police officers) and going through intersections while the light was indeed red, which is legal in such situations. I've done it myself, but luckily Richmond doesn't have those stupid cameras on Monument Avenue. At my grandparents' funerals, we had a police escort. Same at my great-aunt's funeral, as well as my uncle's funeral. We went through several red lights with the police officer blocking the intersection from on-coming traffic.

This is why you can go to court and plead "not guilty."

[jimjames418]

My department doesn't get **** for any tickets we write.

FYI.
At one time, don't know if it is still true, all traffic fines went to support the local public library. That was when there were JP's handling traffic tickets.

[jimjames418]

The best place to get a ticket in my area is the 27 miles of I-94 between the state line and Benton Harbor. The state police have 16 vehicles in that stretch of roadway, and 8 of them are on the road all the time.
The main function seems to be to ticket the big trucks coming out of Ind where the speed limit for trucks is 65, vs 55 in Michigan. A lot of truck drivers who use their speed control forget to reset when they cross the state line.

[LouC]

I'll ask you again.

What is the worst that can happen as a result of that list being published?

The ultimate worst is some rube will take an alternate route to avoid a "well patrolled" road and the alternate route ends up having serious dangers that that idiotic list does not indicate and as a result the rube ends up in an accident and dead because they were lead footing it on a "speed trap free" road.

The most likely worst is people wasting their time reading about people telling the world that OMG they "spotted" a cop on the side of the road, two weeks ago. :))

But actually the comedic value of that list just might offset all of its negatives.

What might it do, other that causing people to slow down while driving on the indicated routes?

Now see that right there is one reason why that list is a bad idea.

Thanks for pointing it out.

A significant cause of accidents is the disparate speeds of vehicles traveling on the same roadway.

That is exactly what could happen because of that list when some driver gets to a zone they looked up and slam on their brakes or slow way down below the posted limit and other cars start jamming up behind them.

Why would you object to that?

It creates a possible safety hazard as stated above.

[LouC]

BTW, my absolute pet peeve is people riding my tail while I slow down for construction zones. Again, I'm the only one that seems to do that, and if I see a worker, I slow down whether there's a warning sign or not.

"A motorist drove into a construction zone on the Bishop Ford Freeway early Friday, striking a worker and pinning him against another vehicle."

^^THAT is why. :mad:

Oh man I wish I had a dollar for all the flaming I have gotten over the years for driving the posted speed, or less if the conditions called for it, through this nations construction zones. :eek:

[jimjames418]

Oh man I wish I had a dollar for all the flaming I have gotten over the years for driving the posted speed, or less if the conditions called for it, through this nations construction zones. :eek:
Triva I know but back when I was driving a big rig I kind of enjoyed those long construction zones where the speed limit was 60 except where workers were present. The big rigs could legally go 60 where the normal limit would be 55 or even 50. :whistle:

[LouC]

The main function seems to be to ticket the big trucks coming out of Ind where the speed limit for trucks is 65, vs 55 in Michigan. A lot of truck drivers who use their speed control forget to reset when they cross the state line.

Yes.

The main function behind the ticket is to get the big trucks to be aware of and drive the speed limit.

It is imperative that all drivers have all possible control of their vehicles at all times.

Truck drivers are no more responsible for following that rule than car drivers but they are responsible for controlling bigger, heavier, and almost always more lethal vehicles in an accident instance.

That just might have a little more to do with it as well.

Greater risks usually get greater attention.

[LouC]

Triva I know but back when I was driving a big rig I kind of enjoyed those long construction zones where the speed limit was 60 except where workers were present. The big rigs could legally go 60 where the normal limit would be 55 or even 50. :whistle:

:))

I drove a dump truck for a while and know of what you speak.

I have a big issue with Illinois since it has the Truck over 8 thousand pounds max limit set at 55 on highways and it is 65 for cars.

That just flies in the face of what is known about disparate speeds and accidents. :wall:

[Samm]

:))

I drove a dump truck for a while and know of what you speak.

I have a big issue with Illinois since it has the Truck over 8 thousand pounds max limit set at 55 on highways and it is 65 for cars.

That just flies in the face of what is known about disparate speeds and accidents. :wall:

Yep... right at the edge. And since traffic is usually flowing at 70 mph in a 65 zone; it is over the edge of safe disparate speeds.

[freemind]

It failed miserably when I dug a little deeper and read the full stories of what that website claimed were "6 Cities That Were Caught Shortening Yellow Light Times For Profit".

City 1) Engineering mix up involving a turn signal at the intersection in question. The first story did not reveal any overt or covert attempt to shorten yellow for revenue.

City 2) Existing yellows were already short where cameras were installed.

City 3) Existing yellows were already short where cameras were installed.



The cameras were issuing tickets based on the short yellow times. If the cities were so interested in safety over revenue then they should have checked that the traffic lights were up to standard before installing red light cameras.


City 4) Issue of short yellows known and to be addressed before cameras were installed.


Addressed as in 'we know the yellows are quick, but we aren't going to change that.' One of the city's councilmen mentions the benefit of cameras generating revenue for the city.


City 5) No cameras at all involved with this short yellow story.


Correct. There were no red-light cameras in this story, but police were parked at an intersection with quick yellow times and issuing tickets based on yellow times which didn't meet the recommended standard times.


City 6) Existing yellows were already short where cameras were installed.


Yes, but the cameras were issuing tickets based on a faulty standard. This article mentions a study that increasing the time of the yellow light decreases the chance of an accident. The cities seem more interested in ticketing drivers than making sure their traffic lights meet the recommended standards.


No city was exposed for intentionally reducing yellow light timing to increase revenue.

One of the cities above removed some cameras because they worked so well that it cost more to have them at the intersection than they were generating in revenue.

One of these evil cities had only one camera.

The city that removed the cameras was in Texas where cities must split the revenue with the state making them less profitable.

If these cities are more interested in safety than revenue they should make sure their lights are up to recommended standards before ticketing drivers.

[freemind]

Yes that is the website that lied about the "6 Cities That Were Caught Shortening Yellow Light Times For Profit"

I am aware of their stance on red light cameras.

The website did not lie. These cities were ticketing drivers based on short yellow lights. The red light cameras system is not perfect. In some cases they increase accidents, especially with short yellow times. Some cities use this as a way for easy revenue more than the concern of safety or else the timing of the yellow light would meet the necessary safety standards recommended by the engineers.

[uncledoom]

The website did not lie. These cities were ticketing drivers based on short yellow lights. The red light cameras system is not perfect. In some cases they increase accidents, especially with short yellow times. Some cities use this as a way for easy revenue more than the concern of safety or else the timing of the yellow light would meet the necessary safety standards recommended by the engineers.


Question: Does the yellow light mean "get ready to stop" or "hurry up before I turn red"?

Another good safety idea would be when a traffic light in one direction turns red, allow for a second or two before the other side turns green. That would allow for the intersection to clear...

[Samm]

Question: Does the yellow light mean "get ready to stop" or "hurry up before I turn red"?

Another good safety idea would be when a traffic light in one direction turns red, allow for a second or two before the other side turns green. That would allow for the intersection to clear...

Both of your questions have already been answered. See posts 53 and 56.

[sgdp]

Oh man I wish I had a dollar for all the flaming I have gotten over the years for driving the posted speed, or less if the conditions called for it, through this nations construction zones. :eek:

FINALLY!

Take a road trip with me!





Unless you're one of those people that has to pee every 15 minutes. :wall:

[LouC]

The cameras were issuing tickets based on the short yellow times...

Yes I read all of their versions of the original stories, I also went beyond their linked articles to find out more that wasn't mentioned at the first link.

And still not one of those articles confirmed the title of the article or confirmed the contention made in this thread.

[LouC]

The website did not lie.

Yes they very much did lie.

They gave this headline:

6 Cities That Were Caught Shortening Yellow Light Times For Profit"


And it was every bit a lie.

Not one of those cities was caught "shortening" yellow light times for profit, and in the fuller context of Doug's contention not one was caught shortening yellow light times in conjunction with the installation of red light cameras.

These cities were ticketing drivers based on short yellow lights.

Which as it was shown had nothing to do with the install of cameras.

The red light cameras system is not perfect.

Nothing is.

Many (if not most so far) cities have discovered red light cameras can be more trouble than they are worth.

In some cases they increase accidents, especially with short yellow times.

It isn't the camera that has been the cause of increased accident with the exception of the idiotic ones that had their flash strobes at night blinding other drivers.

The main reason accidents increased was drivers overreaction to the presence of the cameras.

Short yellows should be addressed when the public finds them even if there is no camera associated with the short yellow.

And I ran across cities that had significant reductions in accidents.

Some cities use this as a way for easy revenue more than the concern of safety or else the timing of the yellow light would meet the necessary safety standards recommended by the engineers.

They may think it is going to be easy revenue but in all the researching I did that has been proven to be a fallacy that just doesn't hold water.

Some cities had better results with increasing yellow times over what the engineering studies said should be the minimum.

[LouC]

FINALLY!

Take a road trip with me!





Unless you're one of those people that has to pee every 15 minutes. :wall:

Not unless I make the mistake of drinking six cups of coffee before hitting the road.

[sgdp]

Not unless I make the mistake of drinking six cups of coffee before hitting the road.

:)) Nice!

I recently went on a trip where the other three were not coordinating their potty breaks. Instead of just holding until the whole group had to go, they'd stop for each person LITERALLY every 15 minutes.

:wall::wall::wall:

The kicker is I didn't go the whole time. :eh:

[LouC]

:)) Nice!

I recently went on a trip where the other three were not coordinating their potty breaks. Instead of just holding until the whole group had to go, they'd stop for each person LITERALLY every 15 minutes.

:wall::wall::wall:

The kicker is I didn't go the whole time. :eh:

Been there done that. :))

I miss the road trips with the kids and the wife, but I don't miss getting back up to freeway speeds only to discover someone forgot to go. :twisted:

I can't do the "only when I stop for gas" routine anymore but I can certainly get past 15 minutes.

The last speeding ticket I got was because I let two passengers with full their full bladder complaints talk my better sense into getting a lead foot.

[jimjames418]

I miss the road trips with the kids and the wife, but I don't miss getting back up to freeway speeds only to discover someone forgot to go. :twisted:
Worse is after getting back up to freeway speeds you find you are short one person. :doh:

[sgdp]

Been there done that. :))

I miss the road trips with the kids and the wife, but I don't miss getting back up to freeway speeds only to discover someone forgot to go. :twisted:

I can't do the "only when I stop for gas" routine anymore but I can certainly get past 15 minutes.

The last speeding ticket I got was because I let two passengers with full their full bladder complaints talk my better sense into getting a lead foot.

LOL! That happened to me the other day! "I gotta go! I gotta go! GOOOOOOO!" Of course, there were no places with public restrooms, so what was I supposed to do?

I was born with what the docs called an "Iron Bladder." Get places a lot faster!:mrgreen:

[sgdp]

Worse is after getting back up to freeway speeds you find you are short one person. :doh:

I've never heard of that actually happening outside "Home Alone". ;)

[LouC]

Worse is after getting back up to freeway speeds you find you are short one person. :doh:

Depends on the person. :think:

Equally disquieting would be looking in the rear view and counting an extra head... :eek:

[sgdp]

Depends on the person. :think:

Equally disquieting would be looking in the rear view and counting an extra head... :eek:

Reminds me of the "King of the Hill" where Peggy accidentally brings a Mexican child home.

[LouC]

Reminds me of the "King of the Hill" where Peggy accidentally brings a Mexican child home.

I sort of remember that episode.

[NascarGirl2448]

Reminds me of the "King of the Hill" where Peggy accidentally brings a Mexican child home.

I remember that episode. Peggy's Spanish was horrible, despite being a Spanish teacher.

[sgdp]

I remember that episode. Peggy's Spanish was horrible, despite being a Spanish teacher.

:)) Yup! That's the one! She thought the girl was a student, and commended her on her excellent Spanish. :doh:

[Samm]

:)) Nice!

I recently went on a trip where the other three were not coordinating their potty breaks. Instead of just holding until the whole group had to go, they'd stop for each person LITERALLY every 15 minutes.

:wall::wall::wall:

The kicker is I didn't go the whole time. :eh:

Next time bring along a bunch of empty plastic soda bottles...

[Samm]

Worse is after getting back up to freeway speeds you find you are short one person. :doh:

As long as its not the wife you are probably ok... ;)

[sgdp]

Next time bring along a bunch of empty plastic soda bottles...

Nearly made him go in his drink. ;)

[Samm]

Nearly made him go in his drink. ;)

I was in a small plane once where a guy had to go in his rubber boot. You should have seen him when we landed... hopping on one foot while trying not to spill his boot on himself. ;)

[sgdp]

I was in a small plane once where a guy had to go in his rubber boot. You should have seen him when we landed... hopping on one foot while trying not to spill his boot on himself. ;)

:eek:

Whatta sight to see! :))

[DemonicK9]

States, counties, and municipalities are getting very desperate for cash due to the recession, and I have noticed speed traps have gotten a lot more aggressive over the past year. Law enforcement is coming up with some really sneaky ways to generate as many tickets as possible. I thought I’d seen it all until the other day when I saw an Audi convertible pulled over by an unmarked HONDA ODYSSEY MINIVAN! I’m sure this department writes tickets like gangbusters…I mean who expects a traffic cop to be running radar in an unmarked minivan.

[LouC]

States, counties, and municipalities are getting very desperate for cash due to the recession, and I have noticed speed traps have gotten a lot more aggressive over the past year. Law enforcement is coming up with some really sneaky ways to generate as many tickets as possible. I thought I’d seen it all until the other day when I saw an Audi convertible pulled over by an unmarked HONDA ODYSSEY MINIVAN! I’m sure this department writes tickets like gangbusters…I mean who expects a traffic cop to be running radar in an unmarked minivan.

I have a really super sneaky sure fire way of getting around any speed traps and thus never generating revenue for cities.

I'm willing to share it with people, for a small fee, just PM me and I will tell you how to arrange payment.

[spearmaster]

http://www.speedtrap.org/speed-traps/view/70552

Here's my town's supposed speed trap but I find it hard to feel bad for drivers getting busted simply because people drive like reckless nuts anymore. I'm getting tired of having to slam my brakes on when some idiot suddenly turns right in front of me.

[LouC]

Unless you are watching for this change it is easily overlooked...

Unless you are looking?

Sure is a shame idiot vehicle operators might have to actually pay attention to the road and signs and traffic and things... :wall:

[LouC]

http://www.speedtrap.org/speed-traps/view/70552

Here's my town's supposed speed trap but I find it hard to feel bad for drivers getting busted simply because people drive like reckless nuts anymore. I'm getting tired of having to slam my brakes on when some idiot suddenly turns right in front of me.

Sounds like you won't have them for much longer.

They weren't bringing in the estimated revenue anyway.


June 24, 2009

A ballot measure that would allow voters to decide the future of red light cameras in the City of Chillicothe is in the process of being drafted by the Ross County Board of Elections.

The board has already certified there are enough valid signatures on the petition to place the issue before voters and has begun drafting language for the ballot said Director Nora Madru.

“After we decide on the language, we send it to the (Ohio) Secretary of State’s office and then they make an changes that need to be made,” Madru said.

Madru said the final language will then be approved by the board, a bi-partisan body, before it is placed on the ballot.

LINK (http://www.chillicothegazette.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=200990624015)

[spearmaster]

Sounds like you won't have them for much longer.

They weren't bringing in the estimated revenue anyway.

Chillicothe is not a real big town so I'm not real sure why they were even installed in the first place. I guess maybe they were hoping to bring some revenue. Most people know the cameras are there anyhow.

[LouC]

Chillicothe is not a real big town so I'm not real sure why they were even installed in the first place. I guess maybe they were hoping to bring some revenue. Most people know the cameras are there anyhow.

Yes, they bought into the magic revenue notion.

From what I read it would appear they thought the cameras would bring in 1.5 million.

But that has been reduced to only 1/4 of what they originally thought.

Hardly enough to pay for operating them.

[DLaw911]

What asinine crap.

Just what a driver needs, more reason to ignore the rules of the road and more idiotic BS to distract them while they are doing it. :rolleyes:

Drive alertly, safely, legally, and quit putting me and others at greater risk on the road you selfish bastards that "try to beat the man".Cops I have spoken to tell me they love radar detectors because they are always going off resulting in drivers slowing down when no cops are around.

[DLaw911]

link here....

http://www.speedtrap.org/speed-traps/find/


iPhone has speed trap app that beeps when approaching the redlight cameras also.

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/local/Devices-that-warn-drivers-of-speed_-red-light-cameras-draw-police-ire-7930619-50074717.htmlNot to be super technical but true "speed traps" (in which a vehicle's speed is determined by how long it taked to pass from point A to point B) are illegal. More than a handful of chief's of police in smaller towns have received the royal axe for authorizing the use of this technique.

If you're talking areas of high enforcement, just like with red light cameras they are generally intended to solve deadly accidents at known locations. Like nearby my home where a 4 way stop sign, with flashing red lights, often times becomes a 90 mph game of chicken at 3 am on Saturday nights. I'm more than happy to see the cops out their hauling reckless and dueced drivers off the the slammer. More money for our local government and some dangerous drivers off the road.

[msny]

link here....

http://www.speedtrap.org/speed-traps/find/


iPhone has speed trap app that beeps when approaching the redlight cameras also.

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/local/Devices-that-warn-drivers-of-speed_-red-light-cameras-draw-police-ire-7930619-50074717.html

Heres another tip that could save you $.

If you GPS like I do, then set a waypoint of all the red light and speed traps
in your area.

When your in a hurry and not thinking, it could save you some cash.

[DLaw911]

Heres another tip that could save you $.

If you GPS like I do, then set a waypoint of all the red light and speed traps
in your area.

When your in a hurry and not thinking, it could save you some cash.If people are in so much of a hurry that they need protection to avoid getting cited or arrested for their own lawlessness, then they should not be driving.

I am totally in favor of cops hiding and watching traffic from positions of visible advantage. I want every driver to be afraid of putting the pedal to the metal and running stop lights and signals. Unfortunately there are not enough cops to put the fear of god into enough drivers. What is going to happen, and I guarantee (although do not support) it is vehiclular self enforcement, that is smart cars interfaced with other vehicles, the road and traffic controls that can disable themselves and even write a virtual citation to the driver. But that's at least 50 years off. But a lot closer is automated enforcement for speeding and running stop signs, all done by video/still cameras. This would permit zero tolerance for moving "stops" at stop signs, and would eliminate the basic speed law and create a strict liability offense for going even one MPH over a posted limit which could be digitally lowered if there is road construction, school letting out, or road congestion, etc.

[uncledoom]

Heres another tip that could save you $.

If you GPS like I do, then set a waypoint of all the red light and speed traps
in your area.

When your in a hurry and not thinking, it could save you some cash.


Now that is really silly.