Personal defense weapon

[TinCan]

Well, it seems to be the latest rage to buy a gun for Christmas for "personal defense" so, the little lady is getting me a pistol. :) So I'd like to get your recommendations. Depending upon the price, I may even be able to get a new shotgun too!

[E7ALR]

Well, it seems to be the latest rage to buy a gun for Christmas for "personal defense" so, the little lady is getting me a pistol. :) So I'd like to get your recommendations. Depending upon the price, I may even be able to get a new shotgun too!
Depends on the reason "you" want to use it. ie...actual home defense, CCP , sport, target?

[TinCan]

Personal defense and as a potential carry weapon. I've got a double-barrel for home defense and an old carbine for plunking and varmits.

[GoBucks]

Personal defense and as a potential carry weapon. I've got a double-barrel for home defense and an old carbine for plunking and varmits.

Nothing scarier than hearing the pump action in a dark house that your not supposed to be in

[czzzaar]

Well, it seems to be the latest rage to buy a gun for Christmas for "personal defense" so, the little lady is getting me a pistol. :) So I'd like to get your recommendations. Depending upon the price, I may even be able to get a new shotgun too!

I recommend an automatic pistol in .40 Smith & Wesson (the S&W refers to the cartridge -- I think most brands produce weapons in this calibur), or .45 ACP. Both of these caliburs are popular and it should be easy to find the ammo.

If you go with a revolver, I prefer .357 Magnum.

Shotguns. 12 gauge pump. I'd go with a smooth bore barrel that can shoot buckshot and slugs.

Rifles:

AR-15
AK-47
SKS
Ruger Mini-30 or Mini-14

[catman]

Well, it seems to be the latest rage to buy a gun for Christmas for "personal defense" so, the little lady is getting me a pistol. :) So I'd like to get your recommendations. Depending upon the price, I may even be able to get a new shotgun too!

If you get a shotgun, a Mossberg 500 is a good choice. They are reasonably priced and are well made. I have one and they are very reliable. I myself prefer a shotgun for "personal defense" as it has more than enough stopping power. They are a load of fun to shoot at the range too. I've never been into pistols that much, but I'd love to get myself a second rifle for range and target shooting.

[ben41281]

Nothing scarier than hearing the pump action in a dark house that your not supposed to be in

Although, looking down the business end of a double barrel, is quite intimidating! It can turn a 300 pound attacker, into a crying little girl!

[ben41281]

Well, it seems to be the latest rage to buy a gun for Christmas for "personal defense" so, the little lady is getting me a pistol. :) So I'd like to get your recommendations. Depending upon the price, I may even be able to get a new shotgun too!

I'm of the old school, I like the 1911. I have a Springfield Armory 1911A1 Mil-Spec. I've had it for many years. It's been to may of the worlds hell-holes with me. Panama, Desert Storm, Somalia, Haiti, Bosnia, Afghanistan, and Iraq. So it's been battle proven. And it's saved my life more than once.

I also have many other great handguns, but that's my favorite.

[Zach]

I recommend an automatic pistol in .40 Smith & Wesson (the S&W refers to the cartridge -- I think most brands produce weapons in this calibur), or .45 ACP. Both of these caliburs are popular and it should be easy to find the ammo.


I second the 40 or 45 for stopping power.

Brand wise, I like Glocks because they are easy to maintain and moderately priced around $500. The 1911's are cool but they cost about $800-$1000 and have more moving parts to look after.

[czzzaar]

I'm of the old school, I like the 1911. I have a Springfield Armory 1911A1 Mil-Spec. I've had it for many years. It's been to may of the worlds hell-holes with me. Panama, Desert Storm, Somalia, Haiti, Bosnia, Afghanistan, and Iraq. So it's been battle proven. And it's saved my life more than once.

I also have many other great handguns, but that's my favorite.

My Kimber Custom Classic 1911 is my favor handgun and has a lot of custom features. It's one of the best out of the box .45's out there. Of course, it's never been tested like yours.

Thank you for your service, btw.

[TinCan]

I've been leaning more towards a 1911 because I believe in it's stopping power and it always felt comfortable. I looked at the .40 but don't know much about them. 9mm seems ok but it doesn't seem to have the stopping power of the 45. I've got a S&W detective 357 mag revolver that was my late mother-in-laws and I do like it but that's the wife's favorite along with the M-1 carbine. So, being a good husband, of course I'll help the little lady in getting me a shiny new pistol for christmas. :)

[czzzaar]

I second the 40 or 45 for stopping power.

Brand wise, I like Glocks because they are easy to maintain and moderately priced around $500. The 1911's are cool but they cost about $800-$1000 and have more moving parts to look after.

I have a Glock 19 in 9mm that I'm not really found of, but when the apocolypse happens I'll trade it for a substantial amount of food and medical supplies or a few bars of gold. ;)

[Zach]

I have a Glock 19 in 9mm that I'm not really found of, but when the apocolypse happens I'll trade it for a substantial amount of food and medical supplies or a few bars of gold. ;)

I suggest you have as many calibers as there are stars, when the stuff hits the fan you're going to want to be able to fire whatever shells you come across.

[1ProudAmerican]

I own several guns. My favorite 2 pistols are my Springfield arms XD 40 and XD 45. go with the 4 inch barrel. Light but accurate, easy to break down and clean. Misfires are RARE.

As for the 40 or 45... The 45 is more powerful, but the ammo is more expensive. The 40 works fine. I have both and a concealed handgun permit. I prefer the 40 because i can carry more rounds in the gun.

Devin

[TinCan]

I second the 40 or 45 for stopping power.

Brand wise, I like Glocks because they are easy to maintain and moderately priced around $500. The 1911's are cool but they cost about $800-$1000 and have more moving parts to look after.

My wife's late step-father was a gunsmith and liked the Taurus 45 revolver and 1911. They were fine shooting weapons but then again he was a gunsmith so I don't know whether or not he did anything to them. I was going to buy them from the mother-in-law at the time but didn't have the extra cash. It was just as well because all of his guns found new homes with our city, county, and state law enforcement. :) We gave them first option to buy at resonable prices and they responded.

[E7ALR]

Personal defense and as a potential carry weapon. I've got a double-barrel for home defense and an old carbine for plunking and varmits.I concure with the .40 S&W or .45 ACP. Excelent stopping power, limited range and can be found in small frame models (ie... Colt Commander) which are easy to carry and conceal, but packs all the punch of the round.

[TinCan]

Question, is S&W still made in America?

[ben41281]

My Kimber Custom Classic 1911 is my favor handgun and has a lot of custom features. It's one of the best out of the box .45's out there. Of course, it's never been tested like yours.

Thank you for your service, btw.

The only modifications to my 1911, are replacement grips. Kimbers are a very good choice. They fit my requirements, simple and effective! There are quite a few 1911 makers now a days, but I still go with the Springfield, because they have been making them for quite a while. With a good track record. Colt, used to make really good ones, but now their work isn't as good (personal opinion). SIG makes a nice 1911, S&W makes a good one, Para Ordnance makes great ones(some of theirs are DAO), and there are number fo other makers out there. I've always preffered .45ACP, but I would feel comfortable with a .40S&W, or 9mm, or if you want nostalgia, get a .38super. I still don't trust 10mm auto, mainly because of availability. But any where in the country you can get .45ACP or 9mm.

[ben41281]

Question, is S&W still made in America?

Most of Smith & Wessons' products are currently made in the USA, like many manufacturers they do have some products made off shore. My very first handgun was an old S&W model 15 .38special with a 4in barrel. Great revolver, I still have it. It's not my first choice for personal defense, but not my last either. The luxury of having a collection as large as mine(97 guns at last count) I have my choices.

[TinCan]

Well, after all of the inputs a little research, I may opt for the S&W .40. I'm still checking things out though and gonna see who carries them locally and if theres a local range I can use to try it out. I believe a coworker has the .40 Sig so may see about buying some rounds and pay for range time if he'll let me test it out.

[ben41281]

I've been leaning more towards a 1911 because I believe in it's stopping power and it always felt comfortable.
My personal choice! Even though as a Green Beret I was issued a 9mm Beretta M9, I always carried my 1911 .45ACP.





I looked at the .40 but don't know much about them.
Good caliber, it splits the difference between the 9mm and .45ACP.





9mm seems ok but it doesn't seem to have the stopping power of the 45.
9mm is bare minimum. Anything smaller, and you might as well be throwing rocks (In my opinion).





I've got a S&W detective 357 mag revolver that was my late mother-in-laws and I do like it but that's the wife's favorite along with the M-1 carbine. So, being a good husband, of course I'll help the little lady in getting me a shiny new pistol for christmas. :)

I'd go with a 1911, but I'm very partial! I don't do P.C. when it comes to my choice of PDF(Personal Defense Firearm).

[ben41281]

I own several guns. My favorite 2 pistols are my Springfield arms XD 40 and XD 45. go with the 4 inch barrel. Light but accurate, easy to break down and clean. Misfires are RARE.

As for the 40 or 45... The 45 is more powerful, but the ammo is more expensive. The 40 works fine. I have both and a concealed handgun permit. I prefer the 40 because i can carry more rounds in the gun.

Devin

While I like my Springfield 1911 better, it's hard to believe that a pistol from Croatia, the XD, would be right up there! I have three, 9mm, .40S&W, and .45ACP. The 9mm is the 4in, the .40S&W is the sub-compact, and the .45ACP is the 5in. I like them all. But, I still prefer my 1911.

[ben41281]

I have a Glock 19 in 9mm that I'm not really found of, but when the apocolypse happens I'll trade it for a substantial amount of food and medical supplies or a few bars of gold. ;)

Glock, makes very good guns, but I've always been partial to steel construction. I do have two Glocks mod 21 .45ACP, and mod 17 9mm. Both good guns, but I'm still very partial to 1911's.

[ben41281]

I second the 40 or 45 for stopping power.

Brand wise, I like Glocks because they are easy to maintain and moderately priced around $500. The 1911's are cool but they cost about $800-$1000 and have more moving parts to look after.

Most of the moving parts in the 1911 however, rarely have to be serviced. But, it is a more complex pistol than say a Glock or the Springfield XD. But, with a little practice it's no big deal.

[ben41281]

I recommend an automatic pistol in .40 Smith & Wesson (the S&W refers to the cartridge -- I think most brands produce weapons in this calibur), or .45 ACP. Both of these caliburs are popular and it should be easy to find the ammo.

If you go with a revolver, I prefer .357 Magnum.

Shotguns. 12 gauge pump. I'd go with a smooth bore barrel that can shoot buckshot and slugs.

Rifles:

AR-15
AK-47
SKS
Ruger Mini-30 or Mini-14

All of your choices are very good!

[Conan]

I like my Browning 40 cal....I keep it with me at all times.

I have many other handguns, but this one seems to fit perfectly with everyday use.

[Canoedude]

If you are relatively inexperienced or/if you expect somene else who is inexperienced (like maybe your wife), I would suggest a revoler. It's point and shoot, does damage and isn't complicated to use.

I would go with something like the .357 for stopping power.

If you're a bit more comfortable with handguns, as others suggested I would go with the Glock. It is pretty much point and shoot, isn't prone, at all, to jamming and it well balanced. I would get a 45ACP or 40 cal. Stay away from the 45 GAP round as they are harder to find and more expensive.

Many here have suggested shotguns. Yes, the sound is unmistakeable however, in close quarters, like your hallway, stairway or even a medium sized room, long guns are cumbersome and you can be overpowered easier by someone merely grabbing the barrel.

Thats my $.02 coupled with 20 years of law enforcement.

[Conan]

The really depends on the barrel length. ;)

[Darkblade]

i think some states have a trust certificate that allows modification of the barrel to below the normally legal limit by an average citizen with a clean record.

[TinCan]

If you are relatively inexperienced or/if you expect somene else who is inexperienced (like maybe your wife), I would suggest a revoler. It's point and shoot, does damage and isn't complicated to use.

I would go with something like the .357 for stopping power.

If you're a bit more comfortable with handguns, as others suggested I would go with the Glock. It is pretty much point and shoot, isn't prone, at all, to jamming and it well balanced. I would get a 45ACP or 40 cal. Stay away from the 45 GAP round as they are harder to find and more expensive.

Many here have suggested shotguns. Yes, the sound is unmistakeable however, in close quarters, like your hallway, stairway or even a medium sized room, long guns are cumbersome and you can be overpowered easier by someone merely grabbing the barrel.

Thats my $.02 coupled with 20 years of law enforcement.

Oh, I'm quite experience in shooting all kinds of weapons and even have the medals to prove it. ;) And my wife is quite comfortable with all of our current weapons and yes, she has even out shot me a few times. :)

I'm really hoping to get a semi-auto for a personal carry weapon, already have a couple 357 snub nosed revolvers, and maybe a good semi-auto or pump shotgun to augment my trusty double-barrel. I had thought about a new rifle but my reliable M-1 carbine suits my needs right now and besides, the wife likes it.

I'm going to check out the S&W .40. As for shotguns, I've always liked the pump. I'm thinking of a good all around shotgun, something that can do double duty for hunting and skeet shooting, and clear out my hallway if need be. :)

[czzzaar]

I suggest you have as many calibers as there are stars, when the stuff hits the fan you're going to want to be able to fire whatever shells you come across.

Well this is what I have:

.45 ACP
.45 LC
.357 MAG (38 SP +, SP I like that about this gun)
9 mm
.22 Long Rifle
.223
30.06
12 GA

that's a good start. I'd expect to pick up a few more up off the ground if I don't "buy it" early on.

Actually, I might look into getting an AK or SKS between X-Mas and Jan. 20th.

I'm really not that paranoid about riots, and I don't think the Democrats will go right after guns as soon as they take control of the world. There are a lot of States with Concealed Carry Laws and I honestly don't think Washington is ready to push a society that wants it's guns at this point. BUT, you never know.

[czzzaar]

I own several guns. My favorite 2 pistols are my Springfield arms XD 40 and XD 45. go with the 4 inch barrel. Light but accurate, easy to break down and clean. Misfires are RARE.

As for the 40 or 45... The 45 is more powerful, but the ammo is more expensive. The 40 works fine. I have both and a concealed handgun permit. I prefer the 40 because i can carry more rounds in the gun.

Devin

I read in a gun magazine the other day that most shootouts last no more than a few seconds and no more than three shots are fired. I usually have an 8 shot clip with Golden Talons in my 1911, hopefully I'd be standing long enough to get at least three shots off.

[czzzaar]

Glock, makes very good guns, but I've always been partial to steel construction. I do have two Glocks mod 21 .45ACP, and mod 17 9mm. Both good guns, but I'm still very partial to 1911's.

I concur.

I have an Barretta FS-92 in 9mm and I think it feels better in the hand is more accurate than the Glock 19.

The Glock seems to buck and not stay on target. I think it's the slide being heavier than the rest of the gun is the problem I have with it.

My wife gets to carry the Barretta when the zombies attack. ;)

[czzzaar]

I like my Browning 40 cal....I keep it with me at all times.

I have many other handguns, but this one seems to fit perfectly with everyday use.

I've fired a 40 before, not enough to really make a determination, but I figure if the police like it it must be good. Someday, maybe.

I have a friend who has a very large collection (he literally has everything short of full auto machine guns), so I had the opportunity to shoot a wide variety of rifles and pistols. It's a blast to go to the range with him.

[czzzaar]

Oh, I'm quite experience in shooting all kinds of weapons and even have the medals to prove it. ;) And my wife is quite comfortable with all of our current weapons and yes, she has even out shot me a few times. :)

I'm really hoping to get a semi-auto for a personal carry weapon, already have a couple 357 snub nosed revolvers, and maybe a good semi-auto or pump shotgun to augment my trusty double-barrel. I had thought about a new rifle but my reliable M-1 carbine suits my needs right now and besides, the wife likes it.

I'm going to check out the S&W .40. As for shotguns, I've always liked the pump. I'm thinking of a good all around shotgun, something that can do double duty for hunting and skeet shooting, and clear out my hallway if need be. :)

With all this talk of possible civil unrest, I picked up a Special Edition Guns & Ammo: Book of Personal Defense issue off the news stand a couple of weeks ago.

It has some excellent articles, and one of them is on the difference between being a competitive shooter and a shooter trained and really prepared for self-defense.

It really gives you pause to think; sure, I'm a good shot, but I am not, simply not, prepared for close up combat with a handgun. It is two completely different things.

I think I'd much prefer to have my Bushmaster in my hands. That is a weapon I am trained to use.

The other thing is, the vast majority of us are not stone cold killers, and that is a huge disadvantage, because there is going to be a tremendous reluctance, and a hesitation, to actually shoot an another human being.

Canoedude would probably dust me in a heartbeat (not to imply he's a killer, but he IS a professional at using a gun).

[Conan]

Oh, I'm quite experience in shooting all kinds of weapons and even have the medals to prove it. ;) And my wife is quite comfortable with all of our current weapons and yes, she has even out shot me a few times. :)

I'm really hoping to get a semi-auto for a personal carry weapon, already have a couple 357 snub nosed revolvers, and maybe a good semi-auto or pump shotgun to augment my trusty double-barrel. I had thought about a new rifle but my reliable M-1 carbine suits my needs right now and besides, the wife likes it.

I'm going to check out the S&W .40. As for shotguns, I've always liked the pump. I'm thinking of a good all around shotgun, something that can do double duty for hunting and skeet shooting, and clear out my hallway if need be. :)


Most of your skeet and hunting shotguns aren't as good for home defense. I would look for something with 18 to 20 inch barrel 12 gauge pump shotgun with a full size stock. Make sure you can get magazine extension on it. With full size stock even thou it makes the weapon longer and little less mobility around hallways you can always use the stock to crush the guy skull in......and save a shot or 2.

But as with all weapons, you want to fit the gun to the shooter. Like with pistols, make sure your hand fits the grip.....you don't want to be over or under gripping your gun. It should feel natural.....like sipping fresh cup of coffee from your favorite coffee mug.

[sgtmac_46]

I second the 40 or 45 for stopping power.

Brand wise, I like Glocks because they are easy to maintain and moderately priced around $500. The 1911's are cool but they cost about $800-$1000 and have more moving parts to look after.

I move to second.....the GLOCK safe-action pistol is uber-reliable, accurate, and THE MOST LOW-MAINTENANCE firearm you will ever own.

Then go buy a Mossberg 500 or 590 pump for about $270.00 or so.

As for the 1911, i'm personally in love with the 1911.....but it's not a gun for the casual shooter or someone only interested in a personal defense weapon. It's an aficionado's weapon that requires a true interest in learning to shoot it. In addition, the $800-$1,000 price tag is for a basic gun that may require another $400-$600 worth of gunsmithing to actually start to run correctly.

Out of the box self-defense? There is no substitute, Simple...Perfection...GLOCK!

[TinCan]

OK, so what's the best .40 cal semi-auto out of the box, average price, and any recommended extras?

What's the best 12 gauge shotgun, average price, and any recommended extras?

Would prefer to buy American but personal defense shouldn't be limited, right.

[trsjr70]

Several friends have recommended the 88 Model Mossberg for a good all-purpose 12 gauge. Stores in the Austin and Killeen area have had it, with a few accessories, for under $200.

Thanks all for the info here, I'm looking at investing in the same hardware very soon, possibly hiding some of it in case Obambizzle becomes POTUS.

[Free Thinker]

OK, so what's the best .40 cal semi-auto out of the box, average price, and any recommended extras?

What's the best 12 gauge shotgun, average price, and any recommended extras?

Would prefer to buy American but personal defense shouldn't be limited, right.

Don't know about the 40. Don't skimp on quality to save a few bucks--- only more cash lying around for someone to take when the gun jams.

You mentioned shooting skeet with the shotgun. If you are going to shoot targets much, you should get an auto loader, not a pump. Remington 11-87, Browning gold, Beretta 391, etc. Keep them clean and they all work fine.

If you want a home defense gun, with which you can occaisionally shoot informal targets, the pump is fine. The Remington 870 Express is the best one out there for not much money.

Get a gun with a 26" barrel if you aren't going to target shoot a lot. A 28" barrel helps with swing for targets. For shooting targets or people in the house, guage doesn't matter (12 or 20). Twentys are smaller and handier, twelves swing better due to the inertia.

[TinCan]

Don't know about the 40. Don't skimp on quality to save a few bucks--- only more cash lying around for someone to take when the gun jams.

You mentioned shooting skeet with the shotgun. If you are going to shoot targets much, you should get an auto loader, not a pump. Remington 11-87, Browning gold, Beretta 391, etc. Keep them clean and they all work fine.

If you want a home defense gun, with which you can occaisionally shoot informal targets, the pump is fine. The Remington 870 Express is the best one out there for not much money.

Get a gun with a 26" barrel if you aren't going to target shoot a lot. A 28" barrel helps with swing for targets. For shooting targets or people in the house, guage doesn't matter (12 or 20). Twentys are smaller and handier, twelves swing better due to the inertia.

Thanks, good points.

[sgtmac_46]

OK, so what's the best .40 cal semi-auto out of the box, average price, and any recommended extras?

What's the best 12 gauge shotgun, average price, and any recommended extras?

Would prefer to buy American but personal defense shouldn't be limited, right.

GLOCK model 22 .40
Mossberg 500 12 gauge

[TinCan]

Does anyone own or have tried the Rock Island Armory 1911 Tactical?

[TinCan]

GLOCK model 22 .40
Mossberg 500 12 gauge

Thanks. Getting ready to head to the big city of Mobile so going to stop at a few shops to check on prices and get a feel for some of the guns if I can.

[ben41281]

OK, so what's the best .40 cal semi-auto out of the box, average price, and any recommended extras?
Either the Springfield XD, or Glock. The two best .40's out of the box IMO. As for extras, as many mags as you can get, and maybe a good holster. And your set. No mods need to either. As for price, bothe are in the $500-600 range depending on model. They are a bargain, and yet still very well made!



What's the best 12 gauge shotgun, average price, and any recommended extras?
Mossberg or Remington. Both are very basic, only real extras I would put on them is maybe a light. Price wise depending on options, and model, $200-800.



Would prefer to buy American but personal defense shouldn't be limited, right.

I prefer American most of the time. But, two of my top ten handguns are Glocks and the Springfield XD, both made off shore.

[sgtmac_46]

Does anyone own or have tried the Rock Island Armory 1911 Tactical?

I know someone that owns one.....but here's the thing you have to understand about when talking about 1911's......they ARE NOT reliable and accurate out of the box. They are guns for professional 1911 shooters willing to invest the time and money in to custom work for optimization.

Even Kimber's, Colt's and Springfields, that go for $900.00 to $1200.00 often aren't ready to go out of the box, and sometimes require a few trips to a gunsmith. In order to buy a ready to go 1911 it's about $2,000.00 plus for a Wilson, Ed Brown, Nighthawk, etc. My Nighthawk Talon cost $2,500.00, but it is UBER-Reliable and accurate for that price.

So, unless you are willing to invest in trips to a gunsmith to optimize a $800.00 1911, or buy a full custom for $2,000.00.......don't expect to be able to buy a truly reliable 1911. It's truly an afficionados gun.

If you want out of the box reliability that you really NEVER have to do anything else to but oil or maybe put a pair of nightsights on.......GLOCK, or even the Springfield XD.......buy it, shoot it, abuse it, out of the box performance!

[TinCan]

OK, gonna scratch the 12 gauge. Momma wants a 20 gauge. :) So, any thoughts there?

[ben41281]

I move to second.....the GLOCK safe-action pistol is uber-reliable, accurate, and THE MOST LOW-MAINTENANCE firearm you will ever own.

The Glock is a hard general purpose handgun. I prefer the Springfield XD, just a bit more. But It's a weapon that operates on the same principle, and is just as reliable.





Then go buy a Mossberg 500 or 590 pump for about $270.00 or so.

Either the Mossberg 500 the Remington 870, they are easily tied for first in my book. Both right around the same price, and equally well made and reliable. Either would make a fine all-purpose shotgun, best of all, you can get multipule barrels for either. With one gun and two or three barrels, slug, 18" smoothbore, and 26" or 28" with chokes. You have a gun you can defend your home with and go hunting or skeet shooting with.






As for the 1911, i'm personally in love with the 1911.....but it's not a gun for the casual shooter or someone only interested in a personal defense weapon. It's an aficionado's weapon that requires a true interest in learning to shoot it. In addition, the $800-$1,000 price tag is for a basic gun that may require another $400-$600 worth of gunsmithing to actually start to run correctly.

The only work done on my Springfield 1911, was replacement grips. And it's been proven reliable in all feild conditions, from desert to jungle. Mine has seen more than it's share of combat.





Out of the box self-defense? There is no substitute, Simple...Perfection...GLOCK!

the Glock and the XD, are right up there with double-action revolvers for the simplest of self defense tools.

[ben41281]

OK, gonna scratch the 12 gauge. Momma wants a 20 gauge. :) So, any thoughts there?

Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, can be had in 20gauge. Both are great, and reasonably priced.

[sgtmac_46]

OK, gonna scratch the 12 gauge. Momma wants a 20 gauge. :) So, any thoughts there?

Dissuade her against the 20 gauge. If recoil is the issue, there is plenty of reduced-recoil tactical ammunition available for the 12 that lightens the load. She doesn't have to fire 3" magnum turkey loads to stop an intruder.

[sgtmac_46]

The only work done on my Springfield 1911, was replacement grips. And it's been proven reliable in all feild conditions, from desert to jungle. Mine has seen more than it's share of combat.

That's great, you got a nice gun.....but you'll find that the ratio between such flawless functioning out of the box 1911's and flawless functioning out of the box GLOCKs and XD's show's that 1911's are a crap-shoot. The main problems are barrel and feed ramp issues.

I just wouldn't recommend a 1911 to someone looking for an out of the box defensive weapon. I LOVE the 1911, but you truly have to love it to get the most out of it.

[TinCan]

I know someone that owns one.....but here's the thing you have to understand about when talking about 1911's......they ARE NOT reliable and accurate out of the box. They are guns for professional 1911 shooters willing to invest the time and money in to custom work for optimization.

Even Kimber's, Colt's and Springfields, that go for $900.00 to $1200.00 often aren't ready to go out of the box, and sometimes require a few trips to a gunsmith. In order to buy a ready to go 1911 it's about $2,000.00 plus for a Wilson, Ed Brown, Nighthawk, etc. My Nighthawk Talon cost $2,500.00, but it is UBER-Reliable and accurate for that price.

So, unless you are willing to invest in trips to a gunsmith to optimize a $800.00 1911, or buy a full custom for $2,000.00.......don't expect to be able to buy a truly reliable 1911. It's truly an afficionados gun.

If you want out of the box reliability that you really NEVER have to do anything else to but oil or maybe put a pair of nightsights on.......GLOCK, or even the Springfield XD.......buy it, shoot it, abuse it, out of the box performance!

True about the 1911's so I guess that will be my dream buy. Maybe I'll get one when I get all that free money from Obama if he wins.;)

The Mississippi State Troopers and most of our other law enforcement are carrying the Glock 22 so, that's definately a plus in my book. I saw a price of $438.00 on the GLOCKUS site. Says it comes with 3 15rd mags, carry case, and trigger lock.

[ben41281]

I know someone that owns one.....but here's the thing you have to understand about when talking about 1911's......they ARE NOT reliable and accurate out of the box. They are guns for professional 1911 shooters willing to invest the time and money in to custom work for optimization.

I respectfully disagree! My Springfield has had no alterations to it's operation, and it's very accurate and reliable!






Even Kimber's, Colt's and Springfields, that go for $900.00 to $1200.00 often aren't ready to go out of the box, and sometimes require a few trips to a gunsmith. In order to buy a ready to go 1911 it's about $2,000.00 plus for a Wilson, Ed Brown, Nighthawk, etc. My Nighthawk Talon cost $2,500.00, but it is UBER-Reliable and accurate for that price.

I've found that the Springfields and Kimbers, are the best out of the box 1911's. Both tend to be more than accurate enough, and very reliable.






So, unless you are willing to invest in trips to a gunsmith to optimize a $800.00 1911, or buy a full custom for $2,000.00.......don't expect to be able to buy a truly reliable 1911. It's truly an afficionados gun.

More importantly with 1911's, is training. They are not for someone who only takes it to the range once a year. They are for pros. With a little practice, anyone can be made proficient in the use of them.






If you want out of the box reliability that you really NEVER have to do anything else to but oil or maybe put a pair of nightsights on.......GLOCK, or even the Springfield XD.......buy it, shoot it, abuse it, out of the box performance!

Not much argument with that. I have a slight preference for the XD. But, I would feel good with either.

[ben41281]

That's great, you got a nice gun.....but you'll find that the ratio between such flawless functioning out of the box 1911's and flawless functioning out of the box GLOCKs and XD's show's that 1911's are a crap-shoot. The main problems are barrel and feed ramp issues.

I just wouldn't recommend a 1911 to someone looking for an out of the box defensive weapon. I LOVE the 1911, but you truly have to love it to get the most out of it.

Mine is a Springfield 1911a1 Mil-Spec. As far as I can tell, the Mil-Specs, seem to be the best. Some of the out of the box 1911's just have so much crap on them, that they don't work right. But, your right, I wouldn't suggest them to anyone who isn't willing to put in the range time.

[sgtmac_46]

I respectfully disagree! My Springfield has had no alterations to it's operation, and it's very accurate and reliable! That's not actually what I was saying.....what I said was that you happened to get a well functioning out of the box 1911, an experience that isn't always shared by other 1911 owners. As a firearms instructor I see more 1911's come in that need work than any other gun, and it's owing to the design of the barrel and feed ramp.

If your guns working, great, don't ever sell it......but lots of Springfield and Kimber owners don't have the same luck.


I've found that the Springfields and Kimbers, are the best out of the box 1911's. Both tend to be more than accurate enough, and very reliable. They're the best 'out of the box' 1911's......but that's not saying that many who buy them don't end up having to spend money at the gun smith to get them running right.


More importantly with 1911's, is training. They are not for someone who only takes it to the range once a year. They are for pros. With a little practice, anyone can be made proficient in the use of them. The 1911 trigger is what make's the 1911 exceptional. That's where John Browning's genius really comes in to play. The 1911 trigger is a work of art, and really is superior to just about any other trigger on the market today.

Not much argument with that. I have a slight preference for the XD. But, I would feel good with either. It's personal preference.....i've put a couple dozen rounds through an XD, while i've put probably 50,000 rounds or better through GLOCKS.


All just my humble opinion.

[sgtmac_46]

True about the 1911's so I guess that will be my dream buy. Maybe I'll get one when I get all that free money from Obama if he wins.;)

The Mississippi State Troopers and most of our other law enforcement are carrying the Glock 22 so, that's definately a plus in my book. I saw a price of $438.00 on the GLOCKUS site. Says it comes with 3 15rd mags, carry case, and trigger lock.


If you can get a G22 and 3 15-round mags for $438.00 i'd be buying it QUICK! I wouldn't be wasting time here, i'd be coming back to tell us you ordered it!

[TinCan]

Dissuade her against the 20 gauge. If recoil is the issue, there is plenty of reduced-recoil tactical ammunition available for the 12 that lightens the load. She doesn't have to fire 3" magnum turkey loads to stop an intruder.

Well, she's buying so, not going to push it too much if you know what I mean. :) Hey, this is the little lady that bought me a Winchester Model 94 lever action extra big bore in .375 magnum so, if she wants a 20 gauge then that's what we're gonna get. My daddy didn't raise no fool. ;) Besides, it just expands the range of ammo for my meager collection. Also, I think our youngest is looking to get a 9mm, an M-4 or M-16, and a tactical 12 gauge shotgun with his Guard enlistment bonus and they will more than likely wind up here for storage in the near future.

[sgtmac_46]

Well, she's buying so, not going to push it too much if you know what I mean. :) Hey, this is the little lady that bought me a Winchester Model 94 lever action extra big bore in .375 magnum so, if she wants a 20 gauge then that's what we're gonna get. My daddy didn't raise no fool. ;) Besides, it just expands the range of ammo for my meager collection. Also, I think our youngest is looking to get a 9mm, an M-4 or M-16, and a tactical 12 gauge shotgun with his Guard enlistment bonus and they will more than likely wind up here for storage in the near future.

All i'm saying is that a 20 gauge is an answer to a question that really isn't being asked. The 12 gauge can do everything the 20 gauge can do, including use reduced recoil 12 gauge ammunition with a 20 gauge recoil.

I see no real use for a 20 gauge.

Get a 500/590 Mossberg slap on an aftermarket Knoxx stock recoil reducing stock, and she'll swear she's SHOOTING a .410!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcoUpm0pZ0U

[czzzaar]

Thanks. Getting ready to head to the big city of Mobile so going to stop at a few shops to check on prices and get a feel for some of the guns if I can.

have fun shopping. ;)

[Jrome]

Just thought I'd toss this in in reguards to the 1911.

I have found factory ammo to be the heart of most chambering problems with the 1911 or any auto feed weapon. I have been reloading for all my weapons for well over twenty five years and have found very few if any chambering problems with any of my collections, modified or out of box.

Weak loads will fail to compress the recoil springs on newer weapons leading to smoke stacks. Crisp, hot load tend to fully compress the spring and push the casing well past the ejection port allowing it to be flung more accurately thru the window..

Hope this helps someone.

[Free Thinker]

Well, she's buying so, not going to push it too much if you know what I mean. :) Hey, this is the little lady that bought me a Winchester Model 94 lever action extra big bore in .375 magnum so, if she wants a 20 gauge then that's what we're gonna get. My daddy didn't raise no fool. ;) Besides, it just expands the range of ammo for my meager collection. Also, I think our youngest is looking to get a 9mm, an M-4 or M-16, and a tactical 12 gauge shotgun with his Guard enlistment bonus and they will more than likely wind up here for storage in the near future.

Tin- This sure as hell beats Washington Politics.

The 20 is a fine choice for anything the typical shooter wants to do with the exception of maximizing range on turkey and waterfowl. Across the livingroom rug guage is immaterial, and for most people the lighter smaller guns actually are more handy. My wife has Remington 1100, 20ga and it fits (size and wt) her better than the 12s we've tried.

No one is telling you to buy some 45 knockoff---they're talking Kimber, Colt, Springfield....Likewise skip the Mossbergs and get something better.

Pumps- 870 Express is cheap and ultra reliable. Winchester 1300 (out of production) actually works well too. 870 Wingmaster is much prettier and more expensive but no more reliable. Benelli Nova is another good one but I am not sure if it comes in 20. (Ugly as hell, too) Browning BPS is another good one.

Autos- Remington 11-87, Browning Gold, Beretta 391 are three solid choices which are gas operated. Keep 'em relatively clean and they shoot both light and heavy loads well. Benelli makes their inertia operated guns which are very good....they recoil a bit more, regardless of what their ads say.

A twenty with a 26" barrel is a very handy gun. Like I mentioned before, a 28" barrel helps hit moving targets better in general. All of the above guns hold at least 5 shells with standard sporting tubes...enough for most things outside of a firefight.

In the end, do like everyone else. Buy whatever your wife wants and have fun.

[Canoedude]

I'm going to check out the S&W .40. As for shotguns, I've always liked the pump. I'm thinking of a good all around shotgun, something that can do double duty for hunting and skeet shooting, and clear out my hallway if need be. :)

The S&W .40 is a nice weapon.

As for shotguns, I reccomend people get pump ones because they are easier to shoot, less likely to have a feed jam and simple to clean.

Stay away from the Remington 1187 auto. It jams, sticks and loading form a combat stance is harder because the nose is heavy causing the barrel to drop off target.

[TinCan]

If you can get a G22 and 3 15-round mags for $438.00 i'd be buying it QUICK! I wouldn't be wasting time here, i'd be coming back to tell us you ordered it!

I double checked the site and it's up in Hardy, AR and that price is for individual law enforcement purchases. :(

I found the Springfield XD .40-Duty and the Glock 22 for sale locally at $500.00. It's in Alabama so, if I buy there then I have to have them send it to a shop over here. Gonna check a couple of local shops to see what their prices are. I think I'll get the XD, it felt better.

Oh, and the wife nixed the 20 gauge in preference for a Bersa Thunder 9mm. She said it fit her hand like a glove compared to all of the other pistols she tried. :) So, gotta check on that one too.

[TinCan]

All i'm saying is that a 20 gauge is an answer to a question that really isn't being asked. The 12 gauge can do everything the 20 gauge can do, including use reduced recoil 12 gauge ammunition with a 20 gauge recoil.

I see no real use for a 20 gauge.

Get a 500/590 Mossberg slap on an aftermarket Knoxx stock recoil reducing stock, and she'll swear she's SHOOTING a .410!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcoUpm0pZ0U

Well, her birthday is coming up after the first of the year so I may look into that for her. :mrgreen:

[ben41281]

I double checked the site and it's up in Hardy, AR and that price is for individual law enforcement purchases. :(

I found the Springfield XD .40-Duty and the Glock 22 for sale locally at $500.00. It's in Alabama so, if I buy there then I have to have them send it to a shop over here. Gonna check a couple of local shops to see what their prices are. I think I'll get the XD, it felt better.

The XD is a fine choice!




Oh, and the wife nixed the 20 gauge in preference for a Bersa Thunder 9mm. She said it fit her hand like a glove compared to all of the other pistols she tried. :) So, gotta check on that one too.

The Bersas are really underrated pistols. They are very well made, inexpensive, and pretty reliable. The only thing about them, they do need to be cleaned a little more often, to keep the reliability. When they aren't cleaned regularly they tend to jam.

[TinCan]

The XD is a fine choice!


The Bersas are really underrated pistols. They are very well made, inexpensive, and pretty reliable. The only thing about them, they do need to be cleaned a little more often, to keep the reliability. When they aren't cleaned regularly they tend to jam.

Well, that shouldn't be a problem. Yeah, she forgot all about us having the M-1 carbine until she spotted one at the shop on the wall. So after she picked it up and held it, she decided that what she really needed was another pistol. :) Their price is $359.00 so, I have some checking to do over here in Mississippi. The nice thing is is that this place has a real nice indoor range and it's only going to cost us $5.00 each to shoot over there because they give a big discount to PDs and military. :)

One thing I did observe was a large number of women showing up to shoot their own pistols and at least 5 couples that were buying the little lady a side arm. :) So, I think we've found a good range that's close to home and a new weekend hobby! :)

The crazy thing is, I can buy all of the long guns, ammo, and even the two old german mg's they have for sale but I can't buy a pistol because I'm out of state, go figure.

[ben41281]

Well, that shouldn't be a problem. Yeah, she forgot all about us having the M-1 carbine until she spotted one at the shop on the wall. So after she picked it up and held it, she decided that what she really needed was another pistol. :) Their price is $359.00 so, I have some checking to do over here in Mississippi. The nice thing is is that this place has a real nice indoor range and it's only going to cost us $5.00 each to shoot over there because they give a big discount to PDs and military. :)

Sounds like a pretty good place to go. There is a range not to far from where I am, that's really good. And here in WI, an indoor range is a must in the winter!



One thing I did observe was a large number of women showing up to shoot their own pistols and at least 5 couples that were buying the little lady a side arm. :) So, I think we've found a good range that's close to home and a new weekend hobby! :)

When I go to the range, I usually have the wife, and all four kids in tow. So, yes it can be a great way to spend time with the family.





The crazy thing is, I can buy all of the long guns, ammo, and even the two old german mg's they have for sale but I can't buy a pistol because I'm out of state, go figure.

Remember the same kind of idiots that came up with that law, work in Washington D.C.! Scary to think how dumb they are! Oh, and usually it's the dumbest, that get sent to Washington!

[johnr]

.


9mm is bare minimum. Anything smaller, and you might as well be throwing rocks (In my opinion).




Just for the record:

The Israeli Secret Service(Mossad) use .22's for close up work!!!

When they are on the job, they take half the powder out of the cartridge and aim for the victims kidney's ,coming up behind him in a crowded area if possible.Very few can hear the slight pop the gun makes.

http://www.50states.com/flag/image/nunst016.gif

[ben41281]

Tin- This sure as hell beats Washington Politics.

It's a lot easier to disagree with someone on this topic! No one really gets angry, if you have a different point of view!





The 20 is a fine choice for anything the typical shooter wants to do with the exception of maximizing range on turkey and waterfowl. Across the livingroom rug guage is immaterial, and for most people the lighter smaller guns actually are more handy. My wife has Remington 1100, 20ga and it fits (size and wt) her better than the 12s we've tried.

The 20 is more than enough fore home defense, and great for general purpose hunting/sporting.






No one is telling you to buy some 45 knockoff---they're talking Kimber, Colt, Springfield....Likewise skip the Mossbergs and get something better.

For 1911's Kimber and Springfield are real good, older Colts are good but, the new ones not so much (in my opinion). As for Mossbergs, they are good for the money. I have both a model 500 and a 590. both work well for what I use them for.






Pumps- 870 Express is cheap and ultra reliable. Winchester 1300 (out of production) actually works well too. 870 Wingmaster is much prettier and more expensive but no more reliable. Benelli Nova is another good one but I am not sure if it comes in 20. (Ugly as hell, too) Browning BPS is another good one.

The 870 series, are all very good shotguns. 1300 Whinchesters, are great too. The Benelli Nova, is a great shotgun. I have one of each in my collection.






Autos- Remington 11-87, Browning Gold, Beretta 391 are three solid choices which are gas operated. Keep 'em relatively clean and they shoot both light and heavy loads well. Benelli makes their inertia operated guns which are very good....they recoil a bit more, regardless of what their ads say.

For home defense, I don't prefer a auto. But all the models you mentioned are good guns.





A twenty with a 26" barrel is a very handy gun. Like I mentioned before, a 28" barrel helps hit moving targets better in general. All of the above guns hold at least 5 shells with standard sporting tubes...enough for most things outside of a firefight.

Really, for home defense, I like a barrel about 18" or 20". But if you get either the 870 or one of the Mossbergs, you can buy more than one barrel. For my 870 I have an 18" for home defense, a slug barrel for deer, and a 26" for birds and skeet. Just like my AR-15's I have mutiple uppers for them too. It just saves money that way.







In the end, do like everyone else. Buy whatever your wife wants and have fun.

Ain't that the truth? Do what your wife wants, and then you can have a happy life!

[ben41281]

Just for the record:

The Israeli Secret Service(Mossad) use .22's for close up work!!!

When they are on the job, they take half the powder out of the cartridge and aim for the victims kidney's ,coming up behind him in a crowded area if possible.Very few can hear the slight pop the gun makes.

http://www.50states.com/flag/image/nunst016.gif

What they were doing, was assassinations. But for defense, anything less than 9mm, you might as well be throwing rocks! In my opinion, anyways!

And oh yes, as a Green Beret, they trained us on suppressed .22's for covert work. But, I prefered suppressed 9's or .45's

[ben41281]

Just thought I'd toss this in in reguards to the 1911.

I have found factory ammo to be the heart of most chambering problems with the 1911 or any auto feed weapon. I have been reloading for all my weapons for well over twenty five years and have found very few if any chambering problems with any of my collections, modified or out of box.

Good, high quality, factory ammo usually does pretty good. Not the cheap stuff! I like Hornady, or Federal. They seem to function properly in every firearm I own.






Weak loads will fail to compress the recoil springs on newer weapons leading to smoke stacks. Crisp, hot load tend to fully compress the spring and push the casing well past the ejection port allowing it to be flung more accurately thru the window..

Hope this helps someone.

No argument with your assessment. Also, good lubrication. And general proper care, it should always function.

[markdido]

Nothing scarier than hearing the pump action in a dark house that your not supposed to be in

Without a round already jacked into the chamber, all you have is a very long, very expensive paperweight

[ben41281]

Without a round already jacked into the chamber, all you have is a very long, very expensive paperweight

It's safer to have a home defense weapon, with the chamber empty. So, if your wife who isn't as into firearms as you, can pick it up and not have an accidental discharge! This applies to autos and pumps, for revolvers, I prefer to have all the chambers loaded, and the cylinder open.

To put any of them into use, autos=simply rack the slide or bolt. Pumps=rack the slide. Revolvers=close the cylinder.

And it's that simple!

[Bolshevik Hunter]

Nothing scarier than hearing the pump action in a dark house that your not supposed to be in

Sums it all up. ;)

Pretty much the best home defense fire-arm for one simple reason, no need to shoot. Anyone with half a brain that hears that thing cocked, will run away if they know what is good for them. I also sleep with a Japanese surgical steel knife by my side as well. You know, just in case I have to gut the fool and keep his death silent in order to move him into a position of a liberals opinion of a serious threat.

I keep many weapons on hand, but as far as home defense against an invader, The Shotgun is the best and most powerful.

Now, If we are talking about some 1 million man Red Chinese Army pouring over the hills into your local Neighborhood, or a 1 Million Illegal Alien Mexican rebellion Army doing the same within, well then that is another story. However, as far as home intruder defense, The Shotgun is still the best.

I have a few suggestions concerning a future foreign invasion. I can suggest some solutions for that scenario though as well if need be.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n229/kampkirk88/smiley_gunner.gif ~BH

[SiNNiK]

Well, it seems to be the latest rage to buy a gun for Christmas for "personal defense" so, the little lady is getting me a pistol. :) So I'd like to get your recommendations. Depending upon the price, I may even be able to get a new shotgun too!

Taurus Judge. Can't hardly go wrong with 5 rounds of 000 buck in .410 pistol.

[sgtmac_46]

Just for the record:

The Israeli Secret Service(Mossad) use .22's for close up work!!!

When they are on the job, they take half the powder out of the cartridge and aim for the victims kidney's ,coming up behind him in a crowded area if possible.Very few can hear the slight pop the gun makes.

http://www.50states.com/flag/image/nunst016.gif
Yeah, but they Mossad have the advantage of being able to pretend it wasn't them shooting if all it does is **** someone off.......thus the reason for coming up behind them in the crowd.

Different scenario when someone's shooting at you and you're trying to make them quit it! :))

[sgtmac_46]

The only time anyone is going to hear me working the action is if they were fortunate enough to have survived the first round.

I keep my shotguns without a round in the chamber.....but I chamber them real quietly so as not to scare the prey. ;)

Besides, i've got pumps, by home defense shotgun is a semi-auto Benelli M2 scary black shotgun with 7 in the tube and 1 in the pipe!

[SiNNiK]

Sums it all up. ;)

Pretty much the best home defense fire-arm for one simple reason, no need to shoot. Anyone with half a brain that hears that thing cocked, will run away if they know what is good for them.

They'd run just far enough to not get shot, then watch your house until you've gone to the store, then break in and steal your shotgun. No thanks.

If it's gotten as far as them even seeing my shotgun, they're about to be dead.

[sgtmac_46]

They'd run just far enough to not get shot, then watch your house until you've gone to the store, then break in and steal your shotgun. No thanks.

If it's gotten as far as them even seeing my shotgun, they're about to be dead.
YEP! If someone enters my kill zone, they're leaving toes up!

[BravoBuzzard]

I second that!

I'm of the old school, I like the 1911. I have a Springfield Armory 1911A1 Mil-Spec. I've had it for many years. It's been to may of the worlds hell-holes with me. Panama, Desert Storm, Somalia, Haiti, Bosnia, Afghanistan, and Iraq. So it's been battle proven. And it's saved my life more than once.

I also have many other great handguns, but that's my favorite.

[ben41281]

The only time anyone is going to hear me working the action is if they were fortunate enough to have survived the first round.

I keep my shotguns without a round in the chamber.....but I chamber them real quietly so as not to scare the prey. ;)

Besides, i've got pumps, by home defense shotgun is a semi-auto Benelli M2 scary black shotgun with 7 in the tube and 1 in the pipe!

My primary home defense shotgun, is a side/side double. I've found that, two shots is usually enough. When it's not, I grab either my 1911, or one of my many assault rifles! But, then I have 97 firearms to choose from. All shapes, all sizes!

[keller]

My primary home defense shotgun, is a side/side double. I've found that, two shots is usually enough. When it's not, I grab either my 1911, or one of my many assault rifles! But, then I have 97 firearms to choose from. All shapes, all sizes!

Damn, ben, I feel sorry for the unfortunate intruder who tries to violate you, your family or your property! Very good!!!!

[czzzaar]

My primary home defense shotgun, is a side/side double. I've found that, two shots is usually enough. When it's not, I grab either my 1911, or one of my many assault rifles! But, then I have 97 firearms to choose from. All shapes, all sizes!

Sweet.

[agent_86]

I'm looking at a S&W SW40VE and a Ruger P95 right now.

[TCUFan]

Well, it seems to be the latest rage to buy a gun for Christmas for "personal defense" so, the little lady is getting me a pistol. :) So I'd like to get your recommendations. Depending upon the price, I may even be able to get a new shotgun too!

For the car, .40cal S&W or Glock. For the home, 12-ga. shotgun loaded with .00 buck.

TCUFan

[Mr Common Sense]

1st weapon? Get a .22 cal revolver. It is "safest". Can use short, longs, blanks, mini-shotgun shells, and won't "accidentally discharge", can be used to practice cheaply and without the "flinch" associated with larger calibers.

Being from Connecticut, I suggest Ruger and get "single action". It holds it's value and buy it second hand

[Mr Common Sense]

I like the," I'll keep my freedoms, my guns, and my money----You can keep your change!

Semper Fi "

[czzzaar]

1st weapon? Get a .22 cal revolver. It is "safest". Can use short, longs, blanks, mini-shotgun shells, and won't "accidentally discharge", can be used to practice cheaply and without the "flinch" associated with larger calibers.

Being from Connecticut, I suggest Ruger and get "single action". It holds it's value and buy it second hand

Uh, no.

I disagree completely. A single-six is practically a toy gun and will be quickly outgrown, and is definitely not a home defense weapon. Sure, it can be lethal but it has too many shortcomings and you will be outgunned entirely.

[JeffR]

Main home defense weapon for me is a 20 ga. shotgun.

[ben41281]

Uh, no.

I disagree completely. A single-six is practically a toy gun and will be quickly outgrown, and is definitely not a home defense weapon. Sure, it can be lethal but it has too many shortcomings and you will be outgunned entirely.

I have to agree. Although .22's are fun. I think a better first pistol is more along the lines of either a .38 or .357 revolver. My first handgun was a Smith & Wesson model 15 38spl. 4" barrel. I still have it, I wouldn't consider it my first choice for home defense, but it's not my last either. As for the .22 revolvers, they are an o.k. starter, but more for the purpose of having fun and learning the basics of safety. If I were in the market to buy one of my kids, a first pistol. I would buy a Smith model 19/66, with 4 or 6 inch barrel. That way they can start out, shooting .38spl. and then move on to full house .357mag. when they are ready. And there are plenty of them on the used market, and they do hold their value quite well.

[sgtmac_46]

My primary home defense shotgun, is a side/side double. I've found that, two shots is usually enough. When it's not, I grab either my 1911, or one of my many assault rifles! But, then I have 97 firearms to choose from. All shapes, all sizes!

I've got plenty of guns, but I only shoot/carry one handgun, one shotgun and one rifle.......I've found limiting the choices saves time.....the rest of the guns are in the gun safes.

Side-by-Side double is certainly more than sufficient for home defense.....heck, a single shot 12 gauge in semi-skilled hands is certainly sufficient for dealing with 2-legged incursions on the domicile.........i'm of the same school of thought as Clint Smith in that the best advice is learn to run the gun you've got. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FhgwHQCJwWw

[ben41281]

Damn, ben, I feel sorry for the unfortunate intruder who tries to violate you, your family or your property! Very good!!!!

Don't feel sorry for them. My personal view is, if they come into my home and threaten either my family, my property, or my life, they need to have one thing in mind. Out of the 97 firearms that I currently own, 12 are class 3 full auto or select fire weapons! So, overkill is a real possibility!

Oh, and you can never have too much firepower! As a retired Green Beret, I do know how to use them all!

[ben41281]

I've got plenty of guns, but I only shoot/carry one handgun, one shotgun and one rifle.......I've found limiting the choices saves time.....the rest of the guns are in the gun safes.

I only keep three outside the gun vault myself. My 1911 .45ACP. My Bushmaster AR-15 .223. And my side/side double .12 gauge. By the way, my gun vault, doubles as a bunker, a tornado shelter, and a safe room.





Side-by-Side double is certainly more than sufficient for home defense.....heck, a single shot 12 gauge in semi-skilled hands is certainly sufficient for dealing with 2-legged incursions on the domicile.........i'm of the same school of thought as Clint Smith in that the best advice is learn to run the gun you've got. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FhgwHQCJwWw

Nothing to argue with on that point. No matter what your chosen home defense weapon. The main thing is, learning how to employ it effectively.! With that in mind, almost any good firearm will defend you and your family well.

[sgtmac_46]

I only keep three outside the gun vault myself. My 1911 .45ACP. My Bushmaster AR-15 .223. And my side/side double .12 gauge. By the way, my gun vault, doubles as a bunker, a tornado shelter, and a safe room. A MAN after my own heart! It's good to know that there are other loonies who needed a 'gun vault' bunker! :))


Nothing to argue with on that point. No matter what your chosen home defense weapon. The main thing is, learning how to employ it effectively.! With that in mind, almost any good firearm will defend you and your family well. Yep! What you brought, if it's what you got, then fire it a lot and precisely place your shots!

[ben41281]

A MAN after my own heart! It's good to know that there are other loonies who needed a 'gun vault' bunker! :))

Yep, a loon, or gun nut! With a nice safe place to go and hide, if the s*** hits the fan!


Yep! What you brought, if it's what you got, then fire it a lot and precisely place your shots!

That's the most important thing! I prefer to bring something big, but if all I have is a .22, I can put'em where it hurts!

[Claymore]

I keep a loaded S&W Model66 stainless .357 on the night stand. I carry either a .45 Govt Model Colt or a Llama .380 Govt Model, depending on how I dress.

[Andrew_980]

I love my 1911 and would trade off body parts before parting with that gun. i keep my .38 loaded and a speedloader with it, i prefer to save the springs in the old clips for my 1911

[ben41281]

I keep a loaded S&W Model66 stainless .357 on the night stand. I carry either a .45 Govt Model Colt or a Llama .380 Govt Model, depending on how I dress.

All very good choices. Although I prefer Sringfields and Kimbers, over Colts.

[1countryboy]

I have 3 for PD.

S&W 38 SP

Ruger 40 S&W

Bursa 380

Check out Gallery of Guns.com.

Find local dealers and compare prices. They have good sales all the time not to mention a monthly gun give away

[Calibabe]

Well, it seems to be the latest rage to buy a gun for Christmas for "personal defense" so, the little lady is getting me a pistol. :) So I'd like to get your recommendations. Depending upon the price, I may even be able to get a new shotgun too!


Hell we are doing the same thing. Talked about it a couple of weeks to go and thought with all things that seem to be coming down the pike it might just be a good thing to have a few extra pieces around the house, just in case.

[Jacksmyname]

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http://forums.hannity.com/firestorm/statusicon/post_new.gif November 4th, 2008, 2:02 pm
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Originally Posted by TinCan http://forums.hannity.com/firestorm/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://forums.hannity.com/showthread.php?p=40717121#post40717121)
Well, it seems to be the latest rage to buy a gun for Christmas for "personal defense" so, the little lady is getting me a pistol. :) So I'd like to get your recommendations. Depending upon the price, I may even be able to get a new shotgun too!


Hell we are doing the same thing. Talked about it a couple of weeks to go and thought with all things that seem to be coming down the pike it might just be a good thing to have a few extra pieces around the house, just in case.
__________________


Heh heh
Same here. Bought two new last week, one for each of us as our Christmas presents to each other.

[ben41281]

I've seen several posts, about out of the box 1911's not functioning properly, without being sent off to the gun smith. I own several 1911's, one I've carried all around the world. I'll give you my secret to breaking them in, so they function perfectly.

1. When you first take it out of the box, clean it! Clean it! Clean it! And don't be shy with the gun oil!

2. First trip to range, take your cleaning kit with you. I suggest the first 200 rounds, be the heaviest FMJ's you can get, doesn't matter if it's 9mm, .40S&W, or .45ACP. Every 50 rounds or so, field strip and clean.

3. Buy after market magazines, I prefer Wilson, but Chip McCormick makes good ones too. The cheap magazines are good for use at the range, but not good for a defense or offense role!

If you do those things, you'll have the results I've had. My Springfield has 98% reliability. My Kimber is at 97%. I have a Colt, that's doing about 94%. In all cases, the only malfunctions happen when firing cheap ammo. And most of those are ejection related, not feed related, about 8 out of 10. I recently picked up the new SIG 1911, and will start this process on it, next weekend. It's worked, time and time again for me. Try it, before you go to the gun smith. You'll only be out the time, and ammo. Oh, one more thing. After you've finished the break in, you'll want to do a little trial and error with the differant bullet weights, to find the one your gun works best with. My Springfield works best with Federal 200gr Hydrashok. MY Colt, likes Hornady. My Kimber, works best wit Federal. A little trial and error, will ensure the best results, when it counts!

[ben41281]

If you where considering buying a firearm. Buy it now! A few short months from now, it might get much, much harder!

[TinCan]

Well, I went ahead and picked up a Taurus PT1911 stainless for a sweet total price (taxes included) of $525.00! Couldn't pass it up. :) And I found a XD 40 package for $475.00. The wife said to go ahead and get 2 that I wanted because if need be she can use any weapon we own. :)

So, how did I do?

Also, what are some recommended .45 ACP rounds as there seem to be all sorts of manufacturers, some I'm not familiar with?

Maybe for my birthday or father's day I can talk her into a little bit of reloading gear. ;)

[ben41281]

Well, I went ahead and picked up a Taurus PT1911 stainless for a sweet total price (taxes included) of $525.00! Couldn't pass it up. :) And I found a XD 40 package for $475.00. The wife said to go ahead and get 2 that I wanted because if need be she can use any weapon we own. :)

So, how did I do?

Also, what are some recommended .45 ACP rounds as there seem to be all sorts of manufacturers, some I'm not familiar with?

Maybe for my birthday or father's day I can talk her into a little bit of reloading gear. ;)

Two very good choices. My favorites for .45ACP ammo are, Federal 200 grain Hydrashok, and Hornady 185 grain Hollow Point. My best suggestion is to try a few different types, to see which one gives you the best accuracy. Being I have several 1911's, I've found that no two makers 1911's, like the same ammo.

[TinCan]

Two very good choices. My favorites for .45ACP ammo are, Federal 200 grain Hydrashok, and Hornady 185 grain Hollow Point. My best suggestion is to try a few different types, to see which one gives you the best accuracy. Being I have several 1911's, I've found that no two makers 1911's, like the same ammo.

Thanks.

[sanscleverusername]

Personal defense and as a potential carry weapon. I've got a double-barrel for home defense and an old carbine for plunking and varmits.

I have an HK USP in 40 cal. and would recommend it to anyone. It is a bit large for concealed carry, but they also make a compact variant. I have not shot one though. They are a little costly compared to a Glock, but I think mine was worth every penny.

[mdk190]

I have a Super Soaker with extra storage tanks on each side. Lock and load baby!

[birddog1]

Well, I went ahead and picked up a Taurus PT1911 stainless for a sweet total price (taxes included) of $525.00! Couldn't pass it up. :) And I found a XD 40 package for $475.00. The wife said to go ahead and get 2 that I wanted because if need be she can use any weapon we own. :)

So, how did I do?

Also, what are some recommended .45 ACP rounds as there seem to be all sorts of manufacturers, some I'm not familiar with?

Maybe for my birthday or father's day I can talk her into a little bit of reloading gear. ;)

I am carrying Federal Hydrashock in my HK USP but have heard numerous people rave about Speer Gold Dot self defense loads. You should probably buy a few small boxes of each type you like and run a few through your gun. All pistols have certain ammo they will shoot better and 1911s in praticular can be finiky about what they will shoot especially when it comes to JHPs.

[ben41281]

I am carrying Federal Hydrashock in my HK USP but have heard numerous people rave about Speer Gold Dot self defense loads. You should probably buy a few small boxes of each type you like and run a few through your gun. All pistols have certain ammo they will shoot better and 1911s in praticular can be finiky about what they will shoot especially when it comes to JHPs.

Both good choices, but my HK USP in .45ACP. Likes, the Hornady 185grain FPD's. All of my 1911's have particular tastes, they all work well with FMJ's. But, they each like a different HP ammo. So it's all about trial and error. But, the same could be said for all my firearms!

[ben41281]

Another lesson in breaking in firearms. Rifles.

The best way to break in a new rifle, is as follows.

First, your first trip to the range, fire one round and clean the bore, fire one round and clean the bore, fire one round and clean the bore, fire one round clean the bore, fire one round clean the bore.

Second, fire five rounds clean the bore, fire five rounds clean the bore, fire five rounds clean the bore, fire five rounds clean the bore, fire five rounds clean the bore. Yeah, I know, I'm repeating myself.

Third, do a thorough cleaning of the rifle. Now your rifle is broken in. If you follow these simple steps, your rifle will have far more consistent accuracy and the barrel will last a lot longer. Take it from a sniper, this works! I have 39 confirmed kills in Iraq and Afghanistan, with rifles broken in, this way. It works.

[czzzaar]

Another lesson in breaking in firearms. Rifles.

The best way to break in a new rifle, is as follows.

First, your first trip to the range, fire one round and clean the bore, fire one round and clean the bore, fire one round and clean the bore, fire one round clean the bore, fire one round clean the bore.

Second, fire five rounds clean the bore, fire five rounds clean the bore, fire five rounds clean the bore, fire five rounds clean the bore, fire five rounds clean the bore. Yeah, I know, I'm repeating myself.

Third, do a thorough cleaning of the rifle. Now your rifle is broken in. If you follow these simple steps, your rifle will have far more consistent accuracy and the barrel will last a lot longer. Take it from a sniper, this works! I have 39 confirmed kills in Iraq and Afghanistan, with rifles broken in, this way. It works.

Wish I would have know that. Well, one of my AR's has never been fired so I'll have to follow that recipe with that one and with any new rifles I aquire.

Should rifled shotgun barrels be treated the same way?

[sgtmac_46]

I have an HK USP in 40 cal. and would recommend it to anyone. It is a bit large for concealed carry, but they also make a compact variant. I have not shot one though. They are a little costly compared to a Glock, but I think mine was worth every penny.

I've got an H&K USP in .40, and you're right.....it's a FINE GUN! If I didn't carry a GLOCK on duty i'd carry an HK.

I'm wanting to pick up the new HK45 before the curtain falls next year, budget willing.

[sgtmac_46]

As far as handgun loads are concerned, I find it to be less an issue that skill at arms.

I fire one gun and I fire it well, it's my G22C. I love collecting handguns, and it's nice to have extras, but I don't spend my time dancing with them. I don't take any other handguns to the range, and I spend all my time and energy honing my skills on just the one handgun.

I wouldn't be concerned whether I have it loaded with the hottest expansion ammunition or FMJ's, i'm confident in my ability to place them in the bodily organs that matter most. To me high-speed expansion ammunition matters a little, but shot placement in a timely manner is EVERYTHING!

So my advice to anyone on defensive handguns is this........find the gun that works for you, don't worry about feeding a dozen mouths at the range, leave EVERYTHING else at home but the one you're going to put your life on the line with, and spend your ammunition money on it. Practice doesn't make perfect, PERFECT practice makes perfect!

[Claymore]

I've seen several posts, about out of the box 1911's not functioning properly, without being sent off to the gun smith. I own several 1911's, one I've carried all around the world. I'll give you my secret to breaking them in, so they function perfectly.

1. When you first take it out of the box, clean it! Clean it! Clean it! And don't be shy with the gun oil!

2. First trip to range, take your cleaning kit with you. I suggest the first 200 rounds, be the heaviest FMJ's you can get, doesn't matter if it's 9mm, .40S&W, or .45ACP. Every 50 rounds or so, field strip and clean.

3. Buy after market magazines, I prefer Wilson, but Chip McCormick makes good ones too. The cheap magazines are good for use at the range, but not good for a defense or offense role!

If you do those things, you'll have the results I've had. My Springfield has 98% reliability. My Kimber is at 97%. I have a Colt, that's doing about 94%. In all cases, the only malfunctions happen when firing cheap ammo. And most of those are ejection related, not feed related, about 8 out of 10. I recently picked up the new SIG 1911, and will start this process on it, next weekend. It's worked, time and time again for me. Try it, before you go to the gun smith. You'll only be out the time, and ammo. Oh, one more thing. After you've finished the break in, you'll want to do a little trial and error with the differant bullet weights, to find the one your gun works best with. My Springfield works best with Federal 200gr Hydrashok. MY Colt, likes Hornady. My Kimber, works best wit Federal. A little trial and error, will ensure the best results, when it counts!



Get the finest grit emory paper you can find and polish the feed ramps until they are almost mirrors. Feed will be flawkess.

[ben41281]

Wish I would have know that. Well, one of my AR's has never been fired so I'll have to follow that recipe with that one and with any new rifles I aquire.

Should rifled shotgun barrels be treated the same way?

Yes! It will result in more consistent accuracy. The break in process is very important in making the rifle more consistent. It's a little time consuming, but well worth it. It will extent the life of the barrel as well. If you have a rifle that hasn't gone through the process, and has been fired, it's accuracy can only be improved minimally, through adjusting the loads or some gun smithing. With vintage military arms, this is less a concern, as most of them have at least been broken in a bit at the factory, before they where shipped to the military. And, often with military rifles, their accuracy is not as important as their functionality. Most military arms from the WWII era, are pretty consistent with accuracy in the 2-4" range at 200yards. Modern AR's and AK's are only designed for about 4" at 100yards. Although they can be, more accurate! If broken in properly, all rifles will be more accurate, more consistent, and last much longer.

[ben41281]

Get the finest grit emory paper you can find and polish the feed ramps until they are almost mirrors. Feed will be flawkess.

I do that to all the feed ramps on my Semi-auto pistols. End result far more reliability. But, there is really no way to get 100% out of them, because of inconsistencies in the ammo. The break in process does work, I would suggest trying it on any handgun. Try it, I guarantee it will make your handgun work far more reliable.

[ben41281]

As far as handgun loads are concerned, I find it to be less an issue that skill at arms.

I fire one gun and I fire it well, it's my G22C. I love collecting handguns, and it's nice to have extras, but I don't spend my time dancing with them. I don't take any other handguns to the range, and I spend all my time and energy honing my skills on just the one handgun.

I wouldn't be concerned whether I have it loaded with the hottest expansion ammunition or FMJ's, i'm confident in my ability to place them in the bodily organs that matter most. To me high-speed expansion ammunition matters a little, but shot placement in a timely manner is EVERYTHING!

So my advice to anyone on defensive handguns is this........find the gun that works for you, don't worry about feeding a dozen mouths at the range, leave EVERYTHING else at home but the one you're going to put your life on the line with, and spend your ammunition money on it. Practice doesn't make perfect, PERFECT practice makes perfect!

I'm very proficient with all my firearms. I prefer to be diverse. That way, no matter what I have in my hand, I can use it effectively.

[czzzaar]

Yes! It will result in more consistent accuracy. The break in process is very important in making the rifle more consistent. It's a little time consuming, but well worth it. It will extent the life of the barrel as well. If you have a rifle that hasn't gone through the process, and has been fired, it's accuracy can only be improved minimally, through adjusting the loads or some gun smithing. With vintage military arms, this is less a concern, as most of them have at least been broken in a bit at the factory, before they where shipped to the military. And, often with military rifles, their accuracy is not as important as their functionality. Most military arms from the WWII era, are pretty consistent with accuracy in the 2-4" range at 200yards. Modern AR's and AK's are only designed for about 4" at 100yards. Although they can be, more accurate! If broken in properly, all rifles will be more accurate, more consistent, and last much longer.

I've actually been very happy with the accuracy of the AR that I didn't break-in properly. Do think they may have done it properly at the factory?

Anyway, I'll do as you suggest the next time I take it to the range.

[chip]

Im loving my Kimber .45 for carry.

12 gauge pump at the house

[czzzaar]

Stopped by Bass Pros Outdoor World last night and the ammo was still flying off the shelves. The guys stocking said they could not keep up, especially with .223, and 9mm. They said they have never seen anything like this.

[Mohawk5]

Well, it seems to be the latest rage to buy a gun for Christmas for "personal defense" so, the little lady is getting me a pistol. :) So I'd like to get your recommendations. Depending upon the price, I may even be able to get a new shotgun too!


Depends on the use.

Carry conceal?

House defense?

Just for fun?

[keller]

Stopped by Bass Pros Outdoor World last night and the ammo was still flying off the shelves. The guys stocking said they could not keep up, especially with .223, and 9mm. They said they have never seen anything like this.

Same thing at Academy yesterday. My wife and I were there "shopping" and the manager was in a shocked and stressed out mood.....seems, according to him, it had been a very busy day. They sold 28 weapons Sunday! Same thing with the ammo. He told me that people are saying "a revolution is coming!" When the AR-15's come in they are, literally, sold within an hour or so!

[Abe]

Advice on which firearm(s) to purchase, and whether a firearm should even be your choice, is a big question. People will give you advice that depends on what experiences they've had, (or haven't had), with which weapon, where, and under what conditions.

I have my opinions, but I won't give them here because:

a) These opinions are subjective to gender, previous experience, strength of arm, quality of vision and much, much more.

b) An internet forum is a wonderful medium, but it has its limitations. You never know who is on the other end. I wouldn't go by internet advice on which medicine to use for ANY ailment, which car to purchase or which firearm(s) to get.

[ben41281]

Advice on which firearm(s) to purchase, and whether a firearm should even be your choice, is a big question. People will give you advice that depends on what experiences they've had, (or haven't had), with which weapon, where, and under what conditions.

No, but it can help inform you on your choice.





I have my opinions, but I won't give them here because:

You are among friends here! Don't be shy!







a) These opinions are subjective to gender, previous experience, strength of arm, quality of vision and much, much more.

That's why advice is not the only thing to making your decision. You also need to try then out. Most gun shops that have a range, have similar firearms to try, so then you kind of know what you are getting. Bare minimum, at least try the trigger pull and general feel of the firearm.






b) An internet forum is a wonderful medium, but it has its limitations. You never know who is on the other end. I wouldn't go by internet advice on which medicine to use for ANY ailment, which car to purchase or which firearm(s) to get.

Very true. Again, great place to get pointed in the right direction, but not a road map.

[ben41281]

I just bought another revolver last week, a Smith & Wesson 66 with 4" barrel. I took it to the range over the weekend, it shot beautifully! It's an older model, it has the pinned barrel and recessed cylinder. It's a law enforcement trade in. If you are looking for a first handgun for someone, one of these would be great! Fairly inexpensive, very accurate, and easy to learn how to shoot. You don't have to put full-house magnums in it, to get results! I prefer to shoot .38spcl +P's for defense, less recoil but almost the same effect down range. When I go to the range with a gun like this, to have fun, I shoot some light .38spcl's, minimal recoil and fun to shoot, and fairly inexpensive. You can buy in bulk, for real cheap.

[CMike11]

12 gauge mossberg pump

[Darkblade]

i just got back from looking at (mostly) shotguns at gander mountain. they have just about everything there including the benelli supernova i was looking for. and a benelli black eagle. in addition they also had a bushmaster 450.

i also picked up a few items for my survival ruck out bag like water purification pills, a wire saw, a magnesium fire starter block, a 3 in one p38 style can opener on the end of a short spoon and bottle opener, a couple of small packages of 550 cord, a good mess kit, one of those 38 in one "survival kits in a sardine can" things, some supplemental items for my first aid kit like individual hydro-cortisone packetss, a big ammo case, and 5 days worth of mountain house dehydrated meals.

i still want a few more items for my kit including a small flashlight, a better quality chainsaw chain style roll up saw and the higher durability thicker bivy style space blanket bag and a 500 gal water filter and pump.

[Darkblade]

currently most of my actual basic survival kit items fits into a 1 liter water bottle. but of course the mess kit and rations are in thier own small backpack. i also have a large sized alice pack for if i want to take my pup tent and sleeping bag and other larger items.

[Sneaky SF Dude]

Some of you guys kill me. It's not what you shoot, it's where you shoot. Whatever you decide to get her, make sure you send her to training. No, going out in the back 40 and shooting cans with you isn't training.

Send her to a reputable course by a great instructor. And you go with her, make it a family activity.

[Cav Scout]

Some of you guys kill me. It's not what you shoot, it's where you shoot. Whatever you decide to get her, make sure you send her to training. No, going out in the back 40 and shooting cans with you isn't training.

Send her to a reputable course by a great instructor. And you go with her, make it a family activity.

Well said, and shame on me for not catching it and saying it myself.

[Sneaky SF Dude]

another lesson in breaking in firearms. Rifles.

The best way to break in a new rifle, is as follows.

First, your first trip to the range, fire one round and clean the bore, fire one round and clean the bore, fire one round and clean the bore, fire one round clean the bore, fire one round clean the bore.

Second, fire five rounds clean the bore, fire five rounds clean the bore, fire five rounds clean the bore, fire five rounds clean the bore, fire five rounds clean the bore. Yeah, i know, i'm repeating myself.

Third, do a thorough cleaning of the rifle. Now your rifle is broken in. If you follow these simple steps, your rifle will have far more consistent accuracy and the barrel will last a lot longer. Take it from a sniper, this works! I have 39 confirmed kills in iraq and afghanistan, with rifles broken in, this way. It works.

lol

[Sneaky SF Dude]

I've actually been very happy with the accuracy of the AR that I didn't break-in properly. Do think they may have done it properly at the factory?

Anyway, I'll do as you suggest the next time I take it to the range.

No, they didn't do it at the factory. You are happy with it because that process doesn't have anything to do with accuracy or ARs.

[Sneaky SF Dude]

Wish I would have know that. Well, one of my AR's has never been fired so I'll have to follow that recipe with that one and with any new rifles I aquire.

Should rifled shotgun barrels be treated the same way?

You don't need to do that. Clean it and grease it and shoot it. When you finish shooting it clean it and oil it. Follow the manufacturer's guide on lubing it and use a high quality lube.

[RickRhetoric]

For home defense -- Smith and Wesson's 50 caliber (that's right -- 50 caliber) double action revolver with hollow points.

It'll stop an elephant!

[Sneaky SF Dude]

For home defense -- Smith and Wesson's 50 caliber (that's right -- 50 caliber) double action revolver with hollow points.

It'll stop an elephant!

LOL. Yeah, and the police won't have to ask the neighbors where the shot came from - everyone in town will know.

[ramblin_on]

lol

Scratching my head over this one? Breaking in a rifle? And I never heard a sniper brag about killing anyone before, Is this the new military or something?

[Sneaky SF Dude]

Scratching my head over this one? Breaking in a rifle? And I never heard a sniper brag about killing anyone before, Is this the new military or something?

Yes, a virtual one.

[coyote1880]

A simple well balanced knife.

But you need to know how, and when to use it.

I have seen these children with their elephant guns.

Guns four times to big for them to hold.

Holding them sideways just like Hollywood taught them.

I just shake my head.

The weapon is nothing but a tool.

A true craftsman can create art with rock for a hammer and a piece of flint for a chisel.

[agent_86]

I'm really liking my Ruger P95. But I agree, anything can be used for defense. But the most important thing to use, is your brain.

[Crossriflesonblue]

A simple well balanced knife.

But you need to know how, and when to use it.

I have seen these children with their elephant guns.

Guns four times to big for them to hold.

Holding them sideways just like Hollywood taught them.

I just shake my head.

The weapon is nothing but a tool.

A true craftsman can create art with rock for a hammer and a piece of flint for a chisel.

What kind of steel do you like coyote...

[Mohawk5]

Nothing scarier than hearing the pump action in a dark house that your not supposed to be in

One of the scariest sounds ever!

I agree.

[coyote1880]

What kind of steel do you like coyote...

My best blades are Vasco or Stellite 6-k.

But they are blades I have made myself.

Just make sure to roll the Stellite.

Casting makes it too soft.

I have a very good M-4 but it does not keep an edge as well.

A fine knife, but needs constant attention.

I have one knife that is by far my best.

But the metal is very hard to find.

The trade name is 154-CM.

But they have changed the manufacturing process.

Anything after 1960 is worthless.

[ben41281]

Scratching my head over this one? Breaking in a rifle? And I never heard a sniper brag about killing anyone before, Is this the new military or something?

Are you questioning my background? If you have a high enough security clearance you can read my military packet. If you don't have the clearance, just wait another 7 years (when the freedom of information act kicks in), and I'll post it. And I wasn't really bragging, I was simply stating a fact.

[ben41281]

One of the scariest sounds ever!

I agree.


I preffer my MP5SD, it's virtualy silent. Yet very lethal!

[ben41281]

Yes, a virtual one.


What's your security clearance? I'll tell you who to call, to look up my military packet.

[ben41281]

A simple well balanced knife.

But you need to know how, and when to use it.

I have seen these children with their elephant guns.

Guns four times to big for them to hold.

Holding them sideways just like Hollywood taught them.

I just shake my head.

The weapon is nothing but a tool.

A true craftsman can create art with rock for a hammer and a piece of flint for a chisel.

How very true. I own many firearms, some select-fire and full-auto. But, my best weapon is my brain! It doesn't matter how big the weapon, it only matters how you employ it!

[ben41281]

My best blades are Vasco or Stellite 6-k.

But they are blades I have made myself.

Just make sure to roll the Stellite.

Casting makes it too soft.

I have a very good M-4 but it does not keep an edge as well.

A fine knife, but needs constant attention.

I have one knife that is by far my best.

But the metal is very hard to find.

The trade name is 154-CM.

But they have changed the manufacturing process.

Anything after 1960 is worthless.

I have an old K-Bar. My grandfather carried it in WWII, he gave it to me when I graduated boot camp. I carried it in all the hell holes from Somalia to Afgahnistan to Iraq. It still holds an edge!

[coyote1880]

So your Grandfather was a Marine?

I was with the 4th, but served with every division.

Which was he?

The KaBar is nice...

For a stamped knife.

I prefer a folded steel.

[ben41281]

So your Grandfather was a Marine?

I was with the 4th, but served with every division.

Which was he?

The KaBar is nice...

For a stamped knife.

I prefer a folded steel.

Yes, I'm not sure which unit he was with, I know he fought on Iwo Jima. He wanted me to go into the Marines, but I chose to go into the Army. My unit was 5th SF/101st AB, Green Beret. It was the best years of my life, so far anyway. For 14 long years I trudged around the worlds hell holes. But, someone had to do it.

[coyote1880]

Yes, I'm not sure which unit he was with, I know he fought on Iwo Jima. He wanted me to go into the Marines, but I chose to go into the Army. My unit was 5th SF/101st AB, Green Beret. It was the best years of my life, so far anyway. For 14 long years I trudged around the worlds hell holes. But, someone had to do it.

That would make him 3rd, 4th or 5th.

Any Iwo Jima vet would tell you his beach.

Which was his?

I can narrow it down with that.

You yourself have probably met Sneaky.

The SF in his name does not stand for San Fran :)

[Vernon]

A Ruger .357 Mag. did this at about 27 feet! (Edited to add that is 50 rounds!)

http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/9624/mvc004fxp9.th.jpg (http://img241.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mvc004fxp9.jpg)

[agent_86]

That would make him 3rd, 4th or 5th.

Any Iwo Jima vet would tell you his beach.

Which was his?

I can narrow it down with that.

You yourself have probably met Sneaky.

The SF in his name does not stand for San Fran :)

My Grandfather, now deceased of natural causes, fought on Saipan and Tinian and helped clear the airstrip that launched the Enola Gay. He was volunteered to snipe woman carrying children jumping off the suicide cliffs. He shot them in the legs. They didn't know what else to do, they were jumping off by the dozens and men above and in boats below watched in horror. The Japanese convinced them that the US soldiers would rape them, kill them and then eat their babies!!

He went from private to sarg in the short time he was there.

[agent_86]

A Ruger .357 Mag. did this at about 27 feet! (Edited to add that is 50 rounds!)

http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/9624/mvc004fxp9.th.jpg (http://img241.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mvc004fxp9.jpg)

I think you killed it! :)

[Sneaky SF Dude]

Are you questioning my background? If you have a high enough security clearance you can read my military packet. If you don't have the clearance, just wait another 7 years (when the freedom of information act kicks in), and I'll post it. And I wasn't really bragging, I was simply stating a fact.

Nobody in the military has a classified "packet" - whatever that is. Do you know what it is actually called?

[Sneaky SF Dude]

What's your security clearance? I'll tell you who to call, to look up my military packet.

Double Naught Spy - what's yours Green Beret!?

[Sneaky SF Dude]

How very true. I own many firearms, some select-fire and full-auto. But, my best weapon is my brain! It doesn't matter how big the weapon, it only matters how you employ it!

LOL. I've been out-gunned on occasion, but never at that lev...never mind.

[Sneaky SF Dude]

Yes, I'm not sure which unit he was with, I know he fought on Iwo Jima. He wanted me to go into the Marines, but I chose to go into the Army. My unit was 5th SF/101st AB, Green Beret. It was the best years of my life, so far anyway. For 14 long years I trudged around the worlds hell holes. But, someone had to do it.

So 5th SF/101st AB is one unit?

[Sneaky SF Dude]

A Ruger .357 Mag. did this at about 27 feet! (Edited to add that is 50 rounds!)

http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/9624/mvc004fxp9.th.jpg (http://img241.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mvc004fxp9.jpg)

You the shooter?

[Vernon]

You the shooter?

Yes sir, that's me. USAF/Combat Defense Force for 8 years - shot on the pistol team for 5 of the 8 years. I've seen "great" shooters (not me) leave nothing but one rather large hole in the "X" ring. I guess the old mantra of "sight alignment, breath control, and trigger squeeze" serves one well. I hadn't shot a weapon in years when I shot that target.

Incidentally, several years ago my wife and I went to a range with police officers shooting for qualification...my wife - shooting for the first time - qualified, and some of the officers did not!

[Crossriflesonblue]

My best blades are Vasco or Stellite 6-k.

But they are blades I have made myself.

Just make sure to roll the Stellite.

Casting makes it too soft.

I have a very good M-4 but it does not keep an edge as well.

A fine knife, but needs constant attention.

I have one knife that is by far my best.

But the metal is very hard to find.

The trade name is 154-CM.

But they have changed the manufacturing process.

Anything after 1960 is worthless.

thats some tough and exotic stuff bro, never had or worked anything tougher than Damascus or 0-1....I like the 1095...nothing better than a good piece of steel unless it goes bloop and then boom...:mrgreen:

[MadazzVeteran]

The Model 1911; will bring down most any man. Okay, it will take 2 rounds to bring down a crack head.

[ben41281]

That would make him 3rd, 4th or 5th.

Any Iwo Jima vet would tell you his beach.

Which was his?

I can narrow it down with that.

You yourself have probably met Sneaky.

The SF in his name does not stand for San Fran :)

I'm not sure which beach, I'd have to ask my Mom. My grandfather has scince passed away. I cherrish that K-BAR, I still use it when I go camping or hunting.

I don't know sneaky. I do know what the SF stands for, but I'll be nice.

[coyote1880]

thats some tough and exotic stuff bro, never had or worked anything tougher than Damascus or 0-1....I like the 1095...nothing better than a good piece of steel unless it goes bloop and then boom...:mrgreen:

Metal working and throwing were a part of my upbringing.

After I served I began to experiment with different alloys to see what I could make.

I have only about twenty store bought knives.

The rest are my own.

Damascus and 0-1 are easier to work with but when I am making a knife for balance I want it to be balanced forever.

It takes more work in construction, but it saves much work down the road.

But then again, most of what I make is for throwing.

I have made three swords, but this is a whole other story.

One would not wish to make a long blade of such hard material.

[coyote1880]

My Grandfather, now deceased of natural causes, fought on Saipan and Tinian and helped clear the airstrip that launched the Enola Gay. He was volunteered to snipe woman carrying children jumping off the suicide cliffs. He shot them in the legs. They didn't know what else to do, they were jumping off by the dozens and men above and in boats below watched in horror. The Japanese convinced them that the US soldiers would rape them, kill them and then eat their babies!!

He went from private to sarg in the short time he was there.

The Marshall's and Mariana's were very hectic times.

Many different small wars all being fought and refought all at the same time.

Aguijan was one of the toughest places to dig out.

The suicides were many among the outer Japanese peoples, but we were able to save many.

To them we were baby eaters.

At least they thought we were from what the Imps told them.

That was one part of Oki that I am happy to have missed.

Taking radio reports from that time was hard enough.

[agent_86]

The Marshall's and Mariana's were very hectic times.

Many different small wars all being fought and refought all at the same time.

Aguijan was one of the toughest places to dig out.

The suicides were many among the outer Japanese peoples, but we were able to save many.

To them we were baby eaters.

At least they thought we were from what the Imps told them.

That was one part of Oki that I am happy to have missed.

Taking radio reports from that time was hard enough.

Thank you for your service, from the bottom of my family's hearts. My grandfather was one of the best men I've ever met. I'm sure you fit that description as well. :)

America is blessed to have had such a great generation. Don't want to embarrass you, but I feel the need to say it. I was never aware enough when my grandfather was alive, to appreciate ALL he had done.

Thank you.

[coyote1880]

Thank you for your service, from the bottom of my family's hearts. My grandfather was one of the best men I've ever met. I'm sure you fit that description as well. :)

America is blessed to have had such a great generation. Don't want to embarrass you, but I feel the need to say it. I was never aware enough when my grandfather was alive, to appreciate ALL he had done.

Thank you.

I am being sure your grandfather would probably be saying this.

We had a job to do.

We did the job.

America came together during those times.

We who fought were but a small part of that.

The support we had, from the rebuilding of the Pacific Fleet to the sacrifices people at home made so that we could be supplied, was extrodinary.

Back then, everyone served.

In their own fashion.

We were just lucky enough to have the glory jobs.

:)

[dmaddy1]

y cant we just go back to the days when every house owned a gun (shotgun rifle hand gun ect) and defended their home....i live in the counrty and its takes 20+ min for the police to come...pro gun rights

[ben41281]

y cant we just go back to the days when every house owned a gun (shotgun rifle hand gun ect) and defended their home....i live in the counrty and its takes 20+ min for the police to come...pro gun rights

I ABSOLUTELY AGREE! The best deffense against all those who would do our country, family, or person harm, IS US! And, to do so we need effective equipment, I.E. a good firearm!

[TCUFan]

Well, it seems to be the latest rage to buy a gun for Christmas for "personal defense" so, the little lady is getting me a pistol. :) So I'd like to get your recommendations. Depending upon the price, I may even be able to get a new shotgun too!

Mr. Remington makes the best personal defense weapon in the 870 Express, loaded with .00 buck. You can't beat it for indoor use against an intruder. You don't have to be completely 100% accurate and there's less of a risk of collateral damage from high-velocity rounds going through sheetrock and hitting your kids sleeping in their beds.

For taking out targets from a distance, get the M-14. Nice, heavy shell that can reach out and touch someone from a good distance. Good for keeping people at arm's length, so to speak.

Pistols? Well, if they're close enough to use a pistol, you've screwed up somewhere. You should have left that gunfight a long time ago. But, if you have to have a sidearm, you'll want one chambered for the .45 ACP. Hit someone in the little toe and they're going down. Lots of foot-pounds of energy.

TCUFan

[agent_86]

I am being sure your grandfather would probably be saying this.

We had a job to do.

We did the job.

America came together during those times.

We who fought were but a small part of that.

The support we had, from the rebuilding of the Pacific Fleet to the sacrifices people at home made so that we could be supplied, was extrodinary.

Back then, everyone served.

In their own fashion.

We were just lucky enough to have the glory jobs.

:)

I expected you to say that. Humility is one of the traits my grandfather had too.

Thank you all the same.

[Sneaky SF Dude]

Yes sir, that's me. USAF/Combat Defense Force for 8 years - shot on the pistol team for 5 of the 8 years. I've seen "great" shooters (not me) leave nothing but one rather large hole in the "X" ring. I guess the old mantra of "sight alignment, breath control, and trigger squeeze" serves one well. I hadn't shot a weapon in years when I shot that target.

Incidentally, several years ago my wife and I went to a range with police officers shooting for qualification...my wife - shooting for the first time - qualified, and some of the officers did not!

Excellent work.

A lot of times the females shoot better than we do - less mental baggage and ego.

[Sneaky SF Dude]

i'm not sure which beach, i'd have to ask my mom. My grandfather has scince passed away. I cherrish that k-bar, i still use it when i go camping or hunting.

I don't know sneaky. I do know what the sf stands for, but i'll be nice.

lol

[Sneaky SF Dude]

Mr. Remington makes the best personal defense weapon in the 870 Express, loaded with .00 buck. You can't beat it for indoor use against an intruder. You don't have to be completely 100% accurate and there's less of a risk of collateral damage from high-velocity rounds going through sheetrock and hitting your kids sleeping in their beds.

For taking out targets from a distance, get the M-14. Nice, heavy shell that can reach out and touch someone from a good distance. Good for keeping people at arm's length, so to speak.

Pistols? Well, if they're close enough to use a pistol, you've screwed up somewhere. You should have left that gunfight a long time ago. But, if you have to have a sidearm, you'll want one chambered for the .45 ACP. Hit someone in the little toe and they're going down. Lots of foot-pounds of energy.

TCUFan

Get a piece of sheet rock just like you have in your house and shoot it with that load at the same distance as across your biggest room.

[ben41281]

Get a piece of sheet rock just like you have in your house and shoot it with that load at the same distance as across your biggest room.


Very true. The best shotgun load for home deffense is bird shot. It's effective at across the room distances, and won't go all the way through your walls! It normally only penetrates one sheet of dry wall, and most of the pellets stop in the second layer. At close range the effect on a human, is like one large ragged edged bullet. And, I'm not talking about hunting loads. There are a number of dedicated loads, but target loads are less expensive and just as effective.

[Sneaky SF Dude]

Very true. The best shotgun load for home deffense is bird shot. It's effective at across the room distances, and won't go all the way through your walls! It normally only penetrates one sheet of dry wall, and most of the pellets stop in the second layer. At close range the effect on a human, is like one large ragged edged bullet. And, I'm not talking about hunting loads. There are a number of dedicated loads, but target loads are less expensive and just as effective.

Horse hockey. There is no such thing as a magic round that "won't go all the way through your walls". There is very, very little in the common house that will stop anything.

"Normally"? "Most pellets"? How many does it take to kill a child?

4th General Rule of Firearms Safety. Learned that one in the 7th SF/1ST AB Tank Track Tighteners. I was a cowboy hat for 14 years. Stetson! I have 39 confirmed Aguilas killed in a bar in the Zona Rosa.

[Spock]

Going by the topic title, I'd have to say that most people are not comfortable with a knife and so using one for self defense isn't an option. Granted the movie scene where the woman is in the kitchen, etc. etc.
A handgun that fits your hand, ammo that increases the hydra shock to the body, and practice are the best personal defense weapons I know of.
Of course, if you're willing to put in the time, a decent physical self-defense art is an option too but then I'm trying to suggest a "quick" solution to anyone who may be able to take advantage of the current laws and doesn't have years to invest.

[Claymore]

I've got a 30+y/o, BW field knife that I sometimes wear horizontally in my jean's back belt loops. Ain't failed me yet.
I remember this one time in a little bar in Ciudad de Panama,,,

[coyote1880]

The only time I do not have at least three knives on my person is in the shower.

And even then three are within reach.

I am not afraid of intruders or muggers.

I just always carry them.

It is habit.

Not allowed on planes of course.

I feel naked when I fly.

As I sit here typing, I am wearing six knives.

Four more are within arms reach.

I am counting twenty - two in the room.

But I am thinking I am missing a few that I have forgotten.

Lil coyote carries two everywhere but school.

He and I have arm bracers Maria made for us.

Very smooth, clear pull with short sleeves on.

A clear drop draw with long sleeves.

And nearly invisible with the knives I made for them.

[rhet 2]

The only time I do not have at least three knives on my person is in the shower.

And even then three are within reach.

I am not afraid of intruders or muggers.

I just always carry them.

It is habit.

Not allowed on planes of course.

I feel naked when I fly.

As I sit here typing, I am wearing six knives.

Four more are within arms reach.

I am counting twenty - two in the room.

But I am thinking I am missing a few that I have forgotten.

Lil coyote carries two everywhere but school.

He and I have arm bracers Maria made for us.

Very smooth, clear pull with short sleeves on.

A clear drop draw with long sleeves.

And nearly invisible with the knives I made for them.

When I was being stalked by an insane student, I was forced to take self-defense classes.

The instructors all emphasized that you can RUN from a gun, if you zigzag -- because the likelihood of hitting you is pretty slim.

But NEVER run from a knife -- if they're close enough to use it, they're too close to run from and knives are a lot more deadly than a pistol.

Perhaps I should take Great-Granddaddy's old bowie knife out of its display case and learn to use it, reckon?

[MrDuffy]

In addition to my Kimber Ultra I always have at least one and usually two automatic knives somewhere on my person.
A small tanto blade Boker well hidden and an old fashioned "Italian stiletto" very easily accessed.
Most people really don't like the "snick" of that stiletto or the sight of it when it's produced.

[coyote1880]

A boker fixed blade is a nice field knife.

But I have never liked the balance.

A stiletto is nothing more than a phsycological weapon.

Useless in a real fight, but it can help for you to avoid one.

Other than that it is just a fancy letter opener.

[MrDuffy]

A boker fixed blade is a nice field knife.

But I have never liked the balance.

A stiletto is nothing more than a phsycological weapon.

Useless in a real fight, but it can help for you to avoid one.

Other than that it is just a fancy letter opener.
Works really good for up close and personal unexpected thrust. One thrust. That's all.
Anyway, if it comes down to having to use a knife, I've provably done something radically wrong.

[coyote1880]

If you are unexpected.

But in that case, most times that would mean you are the attacker.

Give me a fixed blade any time.

[MrDuffy]

Ok. But like I said, if it comes down to my knife, something got really screwed up.

[meggers49]

Dissuade her against the 20 gauge. If recoil is the issue, there is plenty of reduced-recoil tactical ammunition available for the 12 that lightens the load. She doesn't have to fire 3" magnum turkey loads to stop an intruder.

My husband recommends the Knoxx stock for shotguns if recoil is a problem. He said it takes all of the recoil out of a 12 ga.

[meggers49]

You the shooter?

hope so, or it was one of those damned weapons that just go around shooting and killing stuff unencumbered by a human trying to control it.........lol... i HATE when they do that.

[meggers49]

Yes sir, that's me. USAF/Combat Defense Force for 8 years - shot on the pistol team for 5 of the 8 years. I've seen "great" shooters (not me) leave nothing but one rather large hole in the "X" ring. I guess the old mantra of "sight alignment, breath control, and trigger squeeze" serves one well. I hadn't shot a weapon in years when I shot that target.

Incidentally, several years ago my wife and I went to a range with police officers shooting for qualification...my wife - shooting for the first time - qualified, and some of the officers did not!

re: your wife's shooting. When my husband had me shoot for the first time (and i wasn't at ALL pleased about it) at his father's new range, he gave me his .38 2" chief's special (model 36) (i hated that gun), he showed me how to shoot it and said ok, give it a try. I put 4 rounds 5x and 1 in the middle of the forehead. My fil (to be) said to him, "don't **** her off". lol. now, I love guns. can't have too much ammo.

I shoot a S&W .357 with an action job that is just so nice. And I always liked my AR 15 with the short barrel (my arms are too short for full size unless I shoot barricade) but my husband got a FN P90 and I'm in love. Such a nice thing to shoot. Highly recommend it!

[ben41281]

My husband recommends the Knoxx stock for shotguns if recoil is a problem. He said it takes all of the recoil out of a 12 ga.

A good option, as are reduced recoil loads. The only time I go for the smaller guages, is when I go hunting. Not that I would feal naked if all I had was a .410ga, but why go for that when a 12ga with reduce recoil loads will have just about the same recoil. Hell most of the time, I use lightly loaded target loads for home defense. Either #7 or #8 shot, it's leathal up close. And normally wont go through more than one layer of dry wall. If you don't believe me, try it. Build a couple walls, 2x4 studs, and dry wall both sides. Very few pellets will come out of the other side. At across the room ranges that's about all that it will do.

[meggers49]

Excellent work.

A lot of times the females shoot better than we do - less mental baggage and ego.

I don't necessarily want to shoot better than anyone. I just want to shoot so that I can hit my target and make sure it can't shoot back.

I am not someone who 'carries'. I leave that to my husband, but I will definately be someone who will use what I have, to take care of what needs to be done and sleep well afterwards. I think women are more pragmatic like that.

[meggers49]

A good option, as are reduced recoil loads. The only time I go for the smaller guages, is when I go hunting. Not that I would feal naked if all I had was a .410ga, but why go for that when a 12ga with reduce recoil loads will have just about the same recoil. Hell most of the time, I use lightly loaded target loads for home defense. Either #7 or #8 shot, it's leathal up close. And normally wont go through more than one layer of dry wall. If you don't believe me, try it. Build a couple walls, 2x4 studs, and dry wall both sides. Very few pellets will come out of the other side. At across the room ranges that's about all that it will do.

well..... our shotgun is upstairs which is where i'd be shooting from (probably) and downhill. my kids (when they lived at home) would have been behind and away. I don't think i'd have fired a round that would have gone in their direction. Listened to my husband for too many years about crossfire. also, our shotgun has slug in it. it's what my husband carried on duty and it's what we have here.

personally, i LOATHE the shotgun. I made myself learn how to shoot it because I wanted to know how to use the guns in my house. First time i shot, it had a pistol grip and a collapsible stock. It wasn't pretty. Got slapped in the face twice with it and nearly broke my cheek. ****ED ME OFF. SOOO I made myself learn how to do it (with a regular stock thank you very much) and found out, it's not that hard, I could hit what I aimed at and I still hated it! lol

I have a .357 and a .9mm that I'd rather use but beggars can't be choosey and if a shotgun is all that's at hand, someone will have a big hole in them from that. Sucks to be them.

[ben41281]

well..... our shotgun is upstairs which is where i'd be shooting from (probably) and downhill. my kids (when they lived at home) would have been behind and away. I don't think i'd have fired a round that would have gone in their direction. Listened to my husband for too many years about crossfire. also, our shotgun has slug in it. it's what my husband carried on duty and it's what we have here.

Slugs are good. They also limmit your liability. One projectile is always less risky than many.





personally, i LOATHE the shotgun. I made myself learn how to shoot it because I wanted to know how to use the guns in my house. First time i shot, it had a pistol grip and a collapsible stock. It wasn't pretty. Got slapped in the face twice with it and nearly broke my cheek. ****ED ME OFF. SOOO I made myself learn how to do it (with a regular stock thank you very much) and found out, it's not that hard, I could hit what I aimed at and I still hated it! lol

It never hurts to learn, except when the learning hits you in the face.





I have a .357 and a .9mm that I'd rather use but beggars can't be choosey and if a shotgun is all that's at hand, someone will have a big hole in them from that. Sucks to be them.

Good choices.

[wndrwmn71]

Sorry I jumped into this thread at the last minute, but as this is a favorite topic of mine, let me add my $0.02.

I have a Glock 32- (compact .357 SIG) with a Glock GTL21 Laser/Tac Light on it as my "main home protection" gun. I also have a Springfield XD-9 (full-size 9mm), a Glock 27 (subcompact .40 cal) as my carry weapon. I also have a Mossberg 500 Persuader 12ga shotgun that is my "fall-back" weapon. I have an assortment of other hunting rifles and a DPMS Panther AR-15 just because I'm a Soldier and wanted an M-4 for posterity. Now on to the actual weapons.

The Springfield XD series is almost hands-down one of the best shooting weapons I've ever fired. The XD-9 is extremely comfortable, and can put rounds in the target QUICKLY and ACCURATELY. Follow-up shots are dead-on. The Glock 27 .40 cal "stubby" is also very controllable and small enough for a woman to conceal. The Glock 32 is my Mr. Big-Badass hand cannon. Since it's a .357 SIG- the semiauto equivalent of a .357 Magnum, there IS a lot of kick, and a report that sounds like artillery, but with practice I ended up putting just as many holes in a 3" circle as my 9mm. The 9mm recoil is like a quick, harmless wrist flip, the .40 is more like a wrist/elbow motion, but totally controllable, while the .357 SIG is akin to Bruce Lee kicking your elbow out of socket, but MAN IS IT FUN!
My next purchase is going to be either a .44 Smith & Wesson revolver or a .45 Para Ordnance semiauto. The Mossberg 500 is a good,dependable shotgun that can take a beating, and to this date, I haven't had any ammo malfunctions. I haven't had any in ANY of my guns for that matter.

As far as why I made these particular choices in firearms- well, I believe a shotgun should be the primary means of home defense, since you don't have to have a lethal, 1500 fps round to do the job. I can load my shotgun sequentially with #4 buckshot, then 00 buckshot, then a slug if the SHTF. The reason I personally advocate one or two additional handguns is location, location, location. What if you fall asleep on the couch and someone kicks in your patio door? What if you pull in your garage and notice your kitchen door is ajar? Are you going to go all the way to your bedroom to retreive your lone home defense weapon? Also, a handgun offers better maneuverability around walls & corners than a long gun. Just somethng to think about.

As far as what type of gun for a woman, I'd say whatever weapon you deicde to buy, have her practice with it, but don't settle for a puny little .22, bacause chances are she can handle more. Have her fire a .380 and then a full-size .45 ACP and you might be surprised which one she handles better!

And one more plus side to a shotgun, nothing, NOTHING, is more intimidating that the sound of a shoutgun racking a shell into the chamber!

Some people tend to think that juries and law enforcement are less likely to "pursue" a victim when they gave a possible assailant every opportunity to leave. All I can say is this, if I rack my weapon and the threat is still coming in my house, then I am immediately justified to shoot as they are a bona-fide threat to my life.

[cmorlan]

I recommend an automatic pistol in .40 Smith & Wesson (the S&W refers to the cartridge -- I think most brands produce weapons in this calibur), or .45 ACP. Both of these caliburs are popular and it should be easy to find the ammo.

If you go with a revolver, I prefer .357 Magnum.

Shotguns. 12 gauge pump. I'd go with a smooth bore barrel that can shoot buckshot and slugs.

Rifles:

AR-15
AK-47
SKS
Ruger Mini-30 or Mini-14

I have the Glock 22 40 S&W, I love it. I also have a Mossberg 500 next up AR-15...